It's sad to hear, but Nellie is right (this coming from a die hard Sonics fan) This isn't a good team, but they are fun to watch. Everyone knows it's going to be a tough few years before this team contends. The defense (or lack there of) has been a complete joke...why can't this young team not defend?? Is it the players? Is it the coaching? what?? Nellie isn't the only one blasting the Sonics. I was watching the Houston game the other night on FSN Houston, and both announcers were blasting the Sonics throughout the entire game, and making themselves laugh with their non stop quips about the Sonics lack of talent. Anyway, I've been really disappointed in the team defense, and I also can't stand the fact that PJ thinks Collison is the answer at center. A guy who can't jump, can't run, can't hang on to the ball, and can't shoot...is not the answer. I've never liked Collison...nothing he does impresses me.

Michael is right about Nellie. There's nothing personal about what Don's saying, it's just the truth, we are not a good team, YET. It's gonna take some time, but we've got serious talent to cultivate and Presti knows what he's doing. After that Michael, I'm not sure what you are thinking.

The defense a complete joke? Come on people, just because Presti, PJ and Co. have announced defense to be the hallmark of this team doesn't mean we are going to allow 65-85 points a night right away. P.S.- Houston and GS aren't from the Eastern Conference, they can put up a lot of points. Everyone is still getting acquainted, and a hand full of these guys are barely old enough to go to a bar. This team will develop, and the defense will too.

As for Collison starting in the middle- thank GOD PJ & Paul aren't being stubborn about having a 7-footer start at Center. Our bigs are terrible right now. Hopefully Swift will come around as he gains confidence with the healing. Its a shame our two best big men are power forwards but both are dramatically more productive than any of the three centers. Check out Collison's stats the second half of last season Michael, he's never going to be a Duncan or a Malone but he's coming into his own.

You must be smoking Crack Chad....what has Collison ever accomplished?? What does he bring to this team that any D League scrub couldn't also bring?? Also, let me get this straight...are you referring to his stats for the 2nd half of LAST season??? Are you kidding me???? ANY stats from that time period (for ANY player) are completely irrelevant. You want to isolate and compare stats from 41 games that had absolutely NO meaning?? Which of those 41 games were meaningful Chad? Answer = 0 By the 2nd half last year, the season was over. Every game was garbage time, scrimmage, now pressure-situations, whatever you want to call it. When has Collison ever come through when something was actually on the line?? Hmmm...last time I can think of, was when he was in college. Collison is not "coming into his own" He has already reached his ceiling, and isn't going to improve this team. The only reason he gets any playing time is because, yes, when compared to the other horrific centers Petro and Sene...he looks like Tim Duncan. If Collison hit free agency, I doubt teams would be flipping out trying to sign him. He is average at best. Sonics have had plenty of average forwards...time to raise the bar a little don't you think?? If I had a nickle for everytime Nick has bobbled the ball out of bounds, or had it stripped out of his hands, I'd be a billionaire.

The 41 games in the second half of last season are the most recent games of Collison's career, making them the most relevant. I understand last season was a joke, but the teams we played didn't just stop trying. These are professional athletes, every night is an opportunity to get their stats up. When Collison went out each night to put up 15 and 10 the competition wasn't lying down. I agree with you, it's time for a better center than Collison. He's a good power forward(not standout), but too short to be a permanent Center. All I'm saying is he's become quite productive and until Presti pulls the trigger on another deal in January or Feb. he and wilcox should start down low. I like both of them but I think we should trade one of them along with one of the point guards and one of the centers for legit Center ready to start and produce.

p.s. these guys at nba.com just released a list of good players to pick up on your fantasy team that most people aren't aware of- no.3 on the list is Mr. Collison. Check it out: http://www.nba.com/fantasy/features/wire_20071024.html

well I hope Collison surprises everyone this year, but I doubt it'll happen....I just don't see him improving at all. He's just benefiting from being on a horrible team...thus, looking like a better player than he really is. He is a decent player, I'll give you that, but the Sonics have been stuck in "mediocre" mode for the past 10 years....and die hard Sonic fans like myself are sick of it. I'm sure Collison is a great guy, and yes, he contributes at times, but my point is that he's not the future. He's not a -player who's gonna take us to the next level. I want to see this team back in the playoffs...don't you?? I want to see this team in the Finals...and we're not gonna do it with players like Collison. Short term--yes, he may be the answer since PJ is out of options, but long term, no. Let's get this season sterted already!

I agree with everything you said. I'm ready for a playoff team. But I think while Collison is never going to be an All-Star, I think if he continues to improve as he did last year we can develop star-players at other positions and make it to the next level with Collison as a starter. But NOT at Center, I agree. I hate to say it but I think Collison or Wilcox has to go. And with this team rebuilding it should be before this years trade deadline so that players can become acquainted and learn to play together with defined roles. If one of the Centers isn't ready by Christmas I think it's time to trade at least one of them along with Collison or Wilcox for a 7-footer who's ready. The clock is ticking and we can't keep waiting on these Centers.

completely agree...and that was my point...it's actually less about Collison, and more about the position he's being forced to play. I cannot believe we have all these centers on this team, and Collison is being asked to play the middle! Doesn't make any sense...and it's not fair to Collison. He's a forward. Period. Oh well, hope things get sorted out sooner rather than later. A trade is needed at some point. Go Sonics!!!

Bring back Payton