Geoff Baker covers the Mariners for The Seattle Times. He provides daily coverage of the team throughout spring training, and during the season.
July 20, 2008 4:32 PM
Posted by Bob Condotta
A quick injury update that manager Jim Riggleman said Carlos Silva may not miss a start after coming out today in the fourth inning with back spasms.
Riggleman said the injury didn't appear serious and called it "just a little spasm.''
Silva seemed a little more upset afterward and when asked if he would make his next start responded "ask the trainer.''
He said it bothered him all game but caught up to him in the fourth when Kelly Shoppach hit what appearaed to be a low fastball into left field for a three-run homer that broke open the game.
Posted by Seth Cotner
4:49 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Is 'back spasm' the new excuse that lets you stay home from school? Seriously, maybe this back spasm thing is contageous. Btw... 12 loses... wouldnt be the worse thing in the world if he misses his next start.
Posted by Ry
4:59 PM, Jul 20, 2008
He's not going to miss his next start? Damn.
Posted by Brian in Tucson
5:01 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Probably should take Geoff's byline off this blog--seems like he's only a part of a group effort. Especially this season.
If Silva is having back spasms (and there's no underlying problem,) maybe he should be doing stretching exercises with Ichiro. Hey! There's something Ichiro could provide some leadership doing!
How about hiring Jay Buhner as "clubhouse leader." These guys are lame-er than a three legged race horse!
As for the loss today, some things DO NOT change, do they?
Posted by headliner
5:12 PM, Jul 20, 2008
I see very little difference between Riggleman and McClaren. Excuses, excuses, excuses, and so forth.
Posted by Ms Fan in Exile
5:22 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Something ain't stirrin' the kool-aid. How is it that all of our pitchers are coming down with "Back Spasms"? Except Felix, of course. I don't remember if his first injury this year was back. Seems like a trainer issue. That, or it is a lack of heart.
Posted by Fatasssilva
5:29 PM, Jul 20, 2008
If only I missed a meal now and then...
Posted by Librocrat
5:30 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Oh, Thank God! I was worried there for a moment that we were going to lose our above average workhorse that can go 7 innings and has shown both health and consistency over the last several years. So glad he's healthy. So. Glad.
Posted by -j.
5:34 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Is this the new mentality of a losing teams pitching staff?
Fall behind early or give up a big inning... come out of the game with some sort of minor injury that, for some odd circumstance, doesn't hurt enough to miss your next start?
Injuries are part of the game but this is getting a tad ridiculous.
Posted by Publicbulldog
5:44 PM, Jul 20, 2008
fat contract, fat gut,fat chance anyone would take him off our hands.
Posted by absolutelyworthlessvidro
5:46 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Good news! I would hate to see the M's lose their ace for even one start.
Posted by Batter Up!!!
6:13 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Loss # 60 and counting...
Why is everyone so upset? We need to lose as many as possible to pick up the #1 draft pick.
We are a game out of last and we need to be the worst team in baseball. What is left to play for this year?
San Diego 37 62 .374
Washington 38 61 .384
Seattle 38 60 .388
Posted by Bums
6:20 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Posted by C-Boyd
6:50 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Easiest post ever:
Carlos Silva sucks and his contract is one of the worst in baseball.
Posted by wag the dog
7:07 PM, Jul 20, 2008
"I see very little difference between Riggleman and McClaren. Excuses, excuses, excuses, and so forth."
The biggest thing they share is that neither had/has much talent to work with. The players somehow escaped a lot of blame earlier this season and while 13-13 with Riggleman is an improvement over the McLaren era, mediocre isn't much better than outright suckage. In the end, you're in the same place - out of the playoffs. So, the front office can continue to fill the roster as it has in the past, relying on expensive, unproductive veterans, or it can wise up and figure out how to supplement the roster with some young, hungry, inexpensive up-and-comers who might actually help turn the team around.
Of course, the damage to the major league roster and the minor league system is so extensive that I don't think we can expect major returns for 2-3 years, but I'd rather rebuild with a plan that eyes contention rather than continuing to muddle along forever.
Posted by Capo
7:14 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Any word on if they plan on limiting Silva's fat ass to one trip to the buffet per day?
I mean seriously, the guy is so friggin fat its amazing they don't have to take him out to the mound in a wheel burrow.
Posted by CheapSeats
7:50 PM, Jul 20, 2008
#1 Draft pick? M's will just trade that away for a Silva, Batista, Bedard, Washburn clone! And, get nothing in return!
"My Oh My" (Pathetic) Mariners Baseball!
Posted by Nat
8:28 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Silva may not miss next start. Kinda like saying 'Silva may not miss next meal.' A no brainer.
So helpful of Riggleman to tell us on the post-game that Silva's in great shape, a real athlete...cuz I never would've known that :)
Posted by Greasy Silva
8:34 PM, Jul 20, 2008
I mean, what would we possibly do without Silva. How terrible it would be if he had a career-ending injury and all the M's would be left with is the insurance money and the urgent need to find another gas can to send out there every five days.
Posted by jj
8:54 PM, Jul 20, 2008
a fat spasm?
Posted by RustyJohn
8:56 PM, Jul 20, 2008
I need to look at the schedule and see if the M's have any double-headers to play due to rainouts, what have you. I think a great promotion would be "See How Much We Suck" night and they can start Silva in the first game and Batista in the next. It would be the first time in MLB history where the back-up catcher pitched in both ends of a double header.
Posted by zoooly
9:21 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Safeco was not built on an ancient Indian burial ground.
The Mariners were built by an idiot named Bill
The curse of BavASSi will haunt us all for many mnay years to come.
meanwhile Bill is sipping on boat drinks while some mook shines his bald melon
Posted by Top pick in 09 draft
10:00 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Three more years of Silva's $12m/year contract along with Joh's $8m/year for the same time period will really hamper this organization. I hope Joh is humiliated enough by basically being transitioned into a personal catcher for RAD that he will ask to have his contract sold to a Japanese team rather than sit on the bench 80% of the time. I'm afraid we are stuck with Silva however with Bonehead Bill being fired, there is only one GM (Sabean) dumb enough to take a contract like that on and he has his hands tied by Zito's contract. This organization is a mess and badly needs to get a real GM in place to get a rebuilding plan put together - hopefully without Armstrong & Lincoln around.
Posted by Esteban
10:10 PM, Jul 20, 2008
Long live Carlos!
Carlos Silva really sucks. In fact, the sucktitude that he exhibits is, in a warped kind of way, really awe-inspiring. I was always secretly impressed by how HoRam could not only keep down a job despite being incompetent at his profession, but actually be given the ball as a starting pitcher every 5th day for something like ĺ of the season despite exhibiting no ability as a pitcher.
However, Carlos takes this to a new level. This guy is paid 12 mil a year for lobbing really hittable meatballs right over the plate. He has less ability than Cha Seung Baek, yet costs considerably more, both now and into the future. And therein lies the Marineresque beauty: that bloated (no pun intended) contract will without a doubt keep him here for a long time, as it both make him un-tradeable and un-releasable (Marinersí brass has yet to understand the meaning of Ďsunk costí).
Go Asdrubal! Mís 110+ losses!
Posted by Oly Mike
10:16 PM, Jul 20, 2008
I havenít posted on the last several blogs, maybe two days ago. And I see everything is about the same as it was. BAD!! And as I have said until we get rid of the Infamous 5 (Batista, Johjima, Silva, Vidro & Washburn) was 6 but Sexson is gone. It is not going to change. With these 5 losers gone the Mariner management would have to bring in some other players. And just about anybody right now would be an improvement. By that I mean just about anybody canít hit or pitch so what is Mariner management afraid of? LOSING Money. Well that is already happening! Attendance is way down and raising the price of Beer wonít cover the loss in revenue anymore and they can sell only so many of those stupid Bobbleheads. I wonder what a Richie Sexson Mariner Bobblehead might be worth in the future. Just about as much as this team if changes are not made and I mean soon. What we are watching right now is not only the demise of the 2008 season but 2009 and maybe 2010 as well if the groundwork for a BETTER-NEW team is not established now. After watching this miserable first half it is readily apparent that it is the Starting rotation, with the exception of Felix, and the ďStarting LineupĒ is the cause of this collapse. We canít blame the Bench players or the Bull pen. Bonehead Bill, Johnny Mac&cheese (bland as you can get) and Donít ever swing at the first pitch Pentland are all gone and that made no difference in this teamís performance. So what is left? Clear the bums out of the starting lineup and rotation!!! Regardless of Big Money and Contracts. Otherwise we will see the same bums put out there next year!! This team cannot afford another dose of disease from these losers infecting the whole team.
Posted by wag the dog
10:46 PM, Jul 20, 2008
"By that I mean just about anybody canít hit or pitch so what is Mariner management afraid of? LOSING Money."
Aren't they going to lose about the same amount of money regardless of whether they keep all the bums for the duration of the season? We're on the hook for these contracts no matter what. Unless some other team would be stupid enough to trade. Unlikely. So guys like Vidro, Bautisa and so forth are really just warm bodies that will allow the Mariners to stagger into the offseason when the real work will have to begin. There's not going to be a quick fix. If not losing money was so important, they wouldn't have allowed this roster to be assembled as it has been in the first place. Expensive, aging, under-performing veterans is not the way to build a club. How many teams in baseball are getting more from oh so much less payroll?
I guess one thing that could be said for dumping all the fat, lazy losers with huge contracts is that whomever would be brought in would be more likable by simple virtue of who they are not. But fan reaction aside, this season sucks and it's going to suck no matter who is out there so why not let the bums muck through it? The more they suck the more clear it becomes that this IS a player issue and not just something that can be blamed on coaching.
And maybe fans will wise up and stop going to games. That, perhaps more than anything, is what will force the front office to make changes. Keep the status quo for the remainder of the season, it's our best hope for substantive change in the off season.
Posted by Mr. X
6:22 AM, Jul 21, 2008
I promised myself that I wouldn't be the blog spell check, at least not as much, but this one really stuck out while I've been catching up on all the threads:
"The reason I'm defensive about it is because I'm a former attorney and I have a much better understanding of what plagarism is and how dishonest it is."
Usually when someone is an expert on something, or even claims to have a "much better understanding" about something, they are able to spell the word. And no, it wasn't a typo, unless he just happened to have 3-4 typos in the same thread. But Adam is all about coincidences, so who knows.
Posted by stango
7:32 AM, Jul 21, 2008
As bas as Silva's been, he's not been worse than HoRam was.
HoRam's WHIP last year: 1.847! That's truly staggering. He was dead last in ERA (7.18) among pitchers with at least 80 IP. Even if you consider ERA a flawed stat, that's pretty bad.
We are stuck with Silva for a while, though, and he's really expensive, for a #4-5 starter. I guess we have 3 fifth starters, huh?
Posted by Ryan
7:39 AM, Jul 21, 2008
I have never, ever, in my life seen so many pitchers either come out early or miss starts completely because of injuries. I bet if this team was winning, this wouldn't happen. Speaking of that, why in the world is Batista still being trotted out there every fifth day?? Why?? He is putrid this year, and probably couldn't get most of us out the way he has pitched. Can we just put him on the DL or git rid of him somehow?? What more could he possibly bring us other that a 4-11 record and an ERA upwards of 7?? What?? Please someone answer that question for me.
Posted by ken
7:45 AM, Jul 21, 2008
Only 10 days to go until the trade deadline and all is quiet on the local front. Not trading guys who have some value in the final year of their contracts (Raul & Rhodes) and using this opportunity to get Wash's $10m 2009 salary freed up would be inexcusable incompetence from our interim GM along with his mentor, Armstrong. Looks like JJ is healthy again & he would have some great trade value as Morrow has shown the ability to be a top-flight closer with Fields waiting in the wings - if our interim GM can get him signed by the 8/15 deadline.
Posted by mikethemailman
8:21 AM, Jul 21, 2008
You want to help this team out people? Quit buying tickets, hotdogs, $8.50 beers, etc...We need to boycott the franchise until further notice. I cut my cable off July 2 so I won't be tempted to watch this team.
Posted by 11Records
8:34 AM, Jul 21, 2008
Speaking of trading Raul, and Wash. And, trading or cutting ties with Vidro..
1) RRS should take a turn starting in Tacoma on Wednesday, and be ready to come back and start for the M's on Monday if Wash is traded.
2) We've all been waiting for Wlad to get hot... Well, he's officially hot. In his last 10 games he's hitting .400. With 7 bombs and 15 RBI. His slugging over that stretch is right around 1.000, and he has 6 walks also, so his OPS must be like 1.50+. Now might be a good time to call him up and insert him in the lineup every day.
3) Victor Diaz has 74 RBI in Tacoma. He has to be able to perform at least at the level that Vidro has.
The Mariners could get rid of all 3 of those dudes, and not expect a significant fall off in performance. Plus, Wash has been pitching his ass off trying to earn his ticket out of town. I'm sure he's elevated his worth over the last month. And with 3 contending teams (AZ, NYY and NYM) all in dire need of an OF, Raul should have some serious value as well.
Let's go Pelekoudas! Make us proud.
Posted by djn429
8:54 AM, Jul 21, 2008
Sitting here in Minnesota, I knew you'd get burned with Silva. What was your GM thinking and why is he still employed? That's a lot of beans over the next 3 years. You guys need to do the the Twins way, and that starts from within, not without. Predictable.
Posted by Oly Mike
8:58 AM, Jul 21, 2008
In relation to Putz's return and probably the call up of anyone from the minor leagues. A Steve Kelley quote!!! :
"A clean inning, in a blemish of a ballgame, on a day that dawned so beautifully but died with the announcement of Sunday's starting lineup".
In the Line-up again, the Infamous 5 (Batista,Johjima, Silva, Vidro & Washburn). Oh yes and Cairo too. But Bench players should not be in the everyday lineup. They will infect and diminish the play of any lineup they are in. Until they go this will happen!!!!!!
Posted by Waz
9:01 AM, Jul 21, 2008
It's frustrating to watch M's games now. Mariners organization is a mess.
Sent Rowland-Smith to Tacoma for Putz? What a joke.
They could have send Batista (Bootista) to Tacoma and keep Rowland-Smith. Rowland-Smith pitch x1000 better than Batista. Rowland-Smith can start the games for Batista?
Silva has to go, figure something else to start beside Silva too. Maybe Jimenez can try and start? I just can't stand to watch Silva or Batista to start pitching anymore.
I think Washburn is doing okay.
Vidro, Johjima and Cairo, they should not play that many games because of their batting average. Reed = CF, Bloomquist = DH and LaHair = 1B.
Do something with Mariners organization to improve and just don't leave remain it as a mess.
Posted by oceansaway
9:15 AM, Jul 21, 2008
I don't often agree with Steve Kelley, but today's column was right on.
We have had a crap of a season, but we can still USE IT FOR SOMETHING, if we begin the process of getting rid of the chaff on the team, bring up some of our AAA or even AA players that deserve a good look, seeing what we can get for any of the tradeable players we have and then combining them with the few players that we want to keep.
Another day of messing with Batista, Cairo, Vidro or Bloomquist in the starting lineup is waste.
WHAT in the FO waiting for? and if it is Riggleman who is making the call with coninuing to play the thirtysomethings instead of Reed, Lahair etc. then he needs to be gone too.
Posted by Brett in Bonney Lake
9:22 AM, Jul 21, 2008
I am not sure why there is so much grief about RRS getting sent down. Get him stretched out in a couple of starts, get him some confidence against minor league hitters, than bring him up in exchange for Morrow and do the same thing. Morrow would take a little longer, but once agin this season is lost.
I do find it odd how many pitchers come out of a game after getting shelled due to "injury", yet don't miss a start.
Anyone else notice the Angels just swept the Red Sox and have the best record in baseball?
Posted by bongo
9:25 AM, Jul 21, 2008
Yes, I don't often agree with Steve Kelley, but this article could not have said it better:
Posted by JP
9:48 AM, Jul 21, 2008
OlyMike; attendance is not down that is the problem. 120K fans for the Cleveland series, now the Red Sox are in town. Until people stop going FO will not change their MO.
I beleived that the FO was throwing this line up out there in hopes to gain trade interest. After hearing Jayson Stark on Mitch this morning I have come to the realization that not having an experienced FO is the root of our trade issues. Did you hear that the Twinkies wanted Beltre. We told them we wanted their two best prospects in return. Of course they said NO! Same thing happened with Ibanez and the Diamondbacks. Stark said something really funny, "what the M's are asking for in return for their players makes people think that they have REALLY good players to trade and if that was true why are they 20 to 21 games under .500" Makes sense doesn't it. Let's price ourselves out of a sellers market because we are still trying to make up for all the crappy moves we made in the past. This FO mindset will doom us for years to come.
Posted by Kev
9:50 AM, Jul 21, 2008
I thought I would catch a few innings of the Mariners prior to a barbeque. As soon as I saw the batting lineup for the Mariners I lost total interest and watched Scooby Doo instead. I wanted to see Clement & Lahair to see what our young guys could do. Damn Guys!! We've seen what Kenji, and Vidro can do. All the scouts know what they can do if you're thinking trades. What is your strategy for re-building this team!!??
Posted by Ryan
10:18 AM, Jul 21, 2008
Our GM is not still employed, we fired him a month ago.
Posted by Ryan
10:21 AM, Jul 21, 2008
Maybe we can call up LaHair and Clement to rot on the bench against the 4 straight lefties we are facing... oh yeah!! Already happened. Playing Johjima, Cairo, and Vidro makes so much more sense. Although Vidro and Cairo each had 3 hits yesterday and probably bought themselves another week.
Posted by Ryan
10:25 AM, Jul 21, 2008
I completely agree with Kev about the lineup. I saw that we had Joh, Cairo, and Vidro out there against Cliff Lee, and I took a nap. How we managed 11 hits, I don't know!!
Posted by frank
9:33 AM, Jul 22, 2008
He pulled this same stuff over the years in Minnesota, getting injured in the middle of the game and then afterword professing to be fine. Glad he is gone from Minny. Have fun with this load of crap for the next 3 1/2 years. Way to spend 32 million wisely. Nice job in losing your basketball team, not that the T-Wolves are anything to talk about.
Jul 21, 08 - 11:18 PM
Lester dominates; Ramirez lectured by traffic cop
Jul 21, 08 - 09:38 PM
Boston Red Sox at Mariners: 07/21 game thread
Jul 21, 08 - 05:34 PM
LaHair, Clement in lineup
Jul 21, 08 - 09:43 AM
Morrow versus Rowland-Smith
Jul 20, 08 - 04:32 PM
Silva may not miss next start