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Geoff Baker covers the Mariners for The Seattle Times. He provides daily coverage of the team throughout spring training, and during the season.

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June 15, 2008 6:01 PM


Posted by Larry Stone

I intimated before the game that another loss would surely push the Mariners to the point where sweeping changes could be in store.

They lost another one, so will changes be coming? I honestly don't know. It's not easy predicting the mindset of CEO Howard Lincoln, and I've thought before that the axe would fall, and it didn't.

But I find it hard to believe that Lincoln is not at the breaking point after the M's were swept by a team that came in as the worst in the National League. He had to have heard the boos that filled the stadium when the last out of the M's 6-2 loss was made. This is a town that has extreme antipathy for their product. Management can't ignore that much longer.

The Mariners have hit some low points before, like losing an entire road trip to Detroit and New York, and getting swept by the Angels to end the last home stand. This is a new low point. As Jarrod Washburn said after the game, speaking with admirable frankness:

"It's been terrible. We find a different way to lose every night...we're just not good. We haven't shown any signs of turning it around. It's frustrating. It's embarrassing."

So now we'll wait and see if John McLaren survives, if Bill Bavasi survives, if Richie Sexson survives. It could get interesting.

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Posted by zona

6:19 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Bring on the repercussions! Anything less than Armstrong, Bavasi & McLaren would be a major disappointment.

Posted by hoke

6:20 PM, Jun 15, 2008

As others have posted I can only hope that the failures of this season do not lead only to sacraficial lambs like firing Pentland. Firing must begin at the top with LIncoln, Armstrong, and Bavasi.

A dfa of Sexson, Vidro, Cairo, Bloomquist, while all of which would be justified, is like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. Management must go, and fans should stay away from the ballpark. It is only the the loss of money that will motivate true change in a front office that is hopelessly out of touch.

Posted by Everyone Must Go!

6:20 PM, Jun 15, 2008

I can't think of five Mariner's players that have earned their keep this year.

Posted by Bail Out

6:20 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Sorry, I am no longer a Mariner fan. I'm a HUGE baseball guy but the M's no longer get me going. They have taken the internation theme to the extreme. Too many gimmicks from Japan, Australia, the Dominican Republic and Korea and not enough guys who can flat play ball. How about some American players?

I'd bring back Griffey as player-manager, retool my team with a bunch of young guys, definitely fire Bavasi, and search for local talent to excite the fans. And I'd do it on the cheap, not 127 mil.

Posted by Bruce

6:22 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Pathetic. If this doesn't trigger major changes (and I'm not refering to firing the janitor) I'm not sure what will. I have spoken with my wallet and have not renewed my MLB package, in spite of repeated special offers (I'm a transplant and live in NorCal). I wish more M's fans did the same and do not go to the games. That's the only language they understand.

This organization is a total disgrace.

Posted by DistantFan

6:35 PM, Jun 15, 2008

I find myself giddy with anticipation. I've not watched or listened to a game in weeks, because of the amount of anger this team and this front office have generated within me. But, now, finally, maybe, we're at the brink of REAL CHANGES.

Oh, sure, the rest of the season is lost. And the rest of the season will probably be dominated by loss after loss. But, maybe, just maybe, the wrong people will be removed, and the ship will set on a new course. And anything- ANYTHING- is better than the mire we fans have force fed the past two-and-a-half months (even longer, actually).

Maybe the rest of the season will become fun to watch again. Something you can enjoy with your kids. And put your M's cap back on, with pride.

They talk about the Mets being laughingstocks right now. Look again. The Mariners own that title.

Posted by Tom

6:41 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Lets hope this is a blessing in disguise and many of the idiots in this organization are immediately run out of town.

Posted by WTF

6:42 PM, Jun 15, 2008

I'd like to know WTF almost 40,000 idiots showed up to the game today?!?!?!?!? You're really sending the message loud and clear Seattle. You're getting what you deserve

Posted by bono98109

6:46 PM, Jun 15, 2008

38K at the game, why would you change anything?

Posted by lifesupport

6:47 PM, Jun 15, 2008

I guess the $100+ million question is what exactly is the fix? Burn the whole thing down and rebuild with youth? Try to get anything for the dead weight with maybe only Beltre even being attractive?

I'm all for change but what is that going to look like? You have to wonder if this team has actually quit because it easier to quit then try hard without the repercussions.

This team needed a couple of messages sent much earlier than now - an not Baek.

Posted by BringBackTheKid

6:47 PM, Jun 15, 2008

What a disgrace this team and organization has become. If not for the opportunity to take in a game with my 91-year-old grandpa, twin brother and Dad, I wouldn't go to a game at all this season. At least the seasons in the late 80's had some fun players to watch, this robotic team of over-paid losers is pathetic and painful to watch.

I can't wait for Seahawks Summer Camp to kick into high gear in late July.

Posted by Briguy17

7:03 PM, Jun 15, 2008

The more repurcussions, the better! Fire everyone!

Posted by J-dub

7:07 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Yeah, bring on the 'Hawks and Huskies . . . I'll have to adopt another MLB team this year (next year, too?). I agree - cut off the head first, and PLEASE get rid of Sexon . . . after that, I don't care. Get rid of 'em before the All-Star break - half a season's plenty too much!

Posted by AZHusky

7:07 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Bill Bavasi is really really good at buying high and selling low. That's why he is a relatively good GM when it comes to the draft (all you gotta do is spend your draft pick on the best available guy) but is very bad when it comes to trades and free agent signings (when you have to judge how much an incoming player WILL BE worth relative to dollars or outgoing players)

We really lucked out with Pat Gillick as he was genious at adhering to simple economic principles. Which was to buy low and sell high

What Bavasi does is akin to only buying stocks that have been rated by all the analysts as reaching it's full potential rather than trying to get in BEFORE the price skyrockets.

It's really a gutless way to be a GM because you're never actually taking any risks because you only go after people who have already performed or put up numbers but by that time you've already missed out on the value of getting that guy while he's on the rise. Which is why it feels like we've always overpaid for all the players on our team. Bavasi has been buying high his whole time as GM here.

In a way, it is worse that the M's actually make money and have a budget to spend because it allows Bavasi the resources to make bad signings. When he was in Anaheim and built what was in essence the foundation of that world series winning team, he had to do it through player development and the draft, not big money FA signings or trades.

Just my economical opinion on why we feel as though we've "overpaid" for nearly every player on this team that we've acquired via free agency or trade.

Posted by Nat

7:09 PM, Jun 15, 2008

As large as these threads get at times it makes more sense to stop bitching & moaning & preaching to the choir and EMAIL Chuck, Howard, Bill, and Mac DIRECTLY and let them know how we feel. Last time I checked the emails were:

Posted by Walla Walla Girl

7:11 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Armstrong: You're out.
Lincoln: Out.
Bavasi: Out.

Booooooooooooo FO. Booooooooooooo. Bye bye FO.

Posted by Stop the Pain

7:12 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Mr Yamauchi must get involved at this point. He bought the Mariners as a thank you to Seattle for the US success of Nintendo. He did not spend hundreds of millions of dollars because of his ego, it was a huge gesture to save baseball in Seattle. However because of the mismanagement by those he entrusted with his generosity, namely Howard Lincoln, Chuck Armstrong, Bill Bavasi, and Grandpa McLaren, all of Mr Yamauchi's goodwill is going down the toilet. Hear that flush Howard, if you had an iota of decency, you would not force Mr Yamauchi to fire you, you would and should resign. Your last act should be to fire your above named incompetent underlings. Then try to explain to Mr Yamauchi, how and why you have wasted over a billion dollars of his money, over the years you have held your position. You can not equivocate or explain how spending as much money as you have each year on payroll, you have embarrassed Mr Yamauchi, the city of Seattle, and every Mariner fan that puts their hearts into this "team". To be swept by the worst team in the NL is stunning in itself, but this fiasco of a collection of overpaid, under talented has beens for the last few years is unforgivable.

Do the only honorable thing that you can at this point, fire your inept and incompetent underlings, and then resign. Save Mr Yamauchi the embarrassment, do it now!

Posted by Walla Walla Girl

7:14 PM, Jun 15, 2008

What is the email address of the team owner?!

Posted by macdoubter

7:16 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Great advice Nat. We need to repost those email addresses every thread for everyone to get. I'm sending a note to all of them every day!

Posted by Nat

7:18 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Walla Walla Girl, I have no idea.

Posted by scottM

7:24 PM, Jun 15, 2008


Why shouldn't the M's hire Bienfest and fire Bavasi? Without directly stating this, you made a great case for Bienfest in your article today. He has done more with less than any GM in baseball. He got his start in Seattle. Can the M's talk to another teams GM without it being considered "tampering"?


Posted by Gunther "Herschel" Rodriguez

7:28 PM, Jun 15, 2008

What in the world are you people talking about?
Can't you smell it?
Wait for it... Waaaait for it....
Will-Bloom is about to break loose... the more playing time he gets, the closer we are to seeing the real Willie Time!!
Yessir, can't you FEEL that 95 magic!? BOO-YAAAHH!!
And Sexson... that guy is on the VERGE!! You can see it in his eyes!! He's just on another little break... right before he starts smacking it all over the place... in fair territory, even!
The MOJO is about to RISE, BABAY!!!!
And Bedard.... we just need a little Mel Magic to make it so ol' Erik throws 12 or less pitches per inning, and we will be golden!!!
This team is ALMOST THERE.... patience, people... patience...

OK, back to reality... Nothing is gonna happen, people. Not a bloody thing. Firing Pentland was the one meek spit-wad across the bow of the sinking USS Mariner that these indecisive imbeciles had in them. Its going to take a miracle out of Japan for anything to happen. Chuck and Howie just don't have it in 'em. *Sigh* Dreadful baseball without a glimmer of hope will continue for the forseeable future, I'm afraid. :(

Posted by northamericanscum

7:30 PM, Jun 15, 2008

I might actually watch this team if they fire Bavasi and Armstrong. I won't spend another dollar until they do.

Posted by Stop the Pain

7:34 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Thank you Nat, I have sent my message to Lincoln, Armstrong, and Bavasi. If we inundate their team email they will have to understand how fans feel. Send the message or don't bitch, take what you get.

7:09 PM, Jun 15, 2008

As large as these threads get at times it makes more sense to stop bitching & moaning & preaching to the choir and EMAIL Chuck, Howard, Bill, and Mac DIRECTLY and let them know how we feel. Last time I checked the emails were:

Posted by new school thinker

7:46 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Everyone on the Mariners professional ball club (not counting anyone currently in the minors) with the exceptions of Ichiro, Felix, Morrow, Lopez, and Beltre should be trade bait. See who's biting, and pull the trigger to get some great young players.

If Yamaguchi and Nintendo would pull thier collective heads out of their arses, they would pay more attention to the team they own and axe the obvious culprits aka Bavasi, Armstrong/Lincoln. Mac is a given at this point, and will probably be gone as soon as this week.

It's time to pull the trigger on this red light special, everyone must go!

Posted by zona

7:46 PM, Jun 15, 2008

"Stop the Pain's" post at 7:12...I couldn't agree more. If LIncoln had any decency he would fire Armstrong/Bavasi/McLaren & then resign along with a huge apology to Mr. Yamauchi.

What good is it going to do to send emails to the very people that need to be fired?

Posted by mfan

7:47 PM, Jun 15, 2008

"Sorry, I am no longer a Mariner fan. I'm a HUGE baseball guy but the M's no longer get me going. They have taken the internation theme to the extreme. Too many gimmicks from Japan, Australia, the Dominican Republic and Korea and not enough guys who can flat play ball. How about some American players?

I'd bring back Griffey as player-manager, retool my team with a bunch of young guys, definitely fire Bavasi, and search for local talent to excite the fans. And I'd do it on the cheap, not 127 mil."

Really? Your decision to remove yourself from the fanbase is one that will be felt for years to come... Seriously, though, I hope you were joking on multiple counts?

Posted by Nat

7:53 PM, Jun 15, 2008

I sent my email off too, cc'd em all the same letter. I kept it civil b/c that's the way I am - I believe if they actually take the time to read it they will continue reading it if I'm not cussing them out. But I wouldn't think of telling anyone else what to do.

Herschel, t's easy to say nothing will happen, and hey, you might be right. But you know the old cliche- no risk, no gain - or something like that. I always get these cliches mixed up. It makes more sense to flood their emails with complaints than to do absolutely nothing!

Posted by johnphil29

7:57 PM, Jun 15, 2008

This team is a disgrace. How much further do they have to fall before they do more than fire a freaking hitting coach? I have written off the season already, and look forward to the Seahawks, and Dawgs. It's hard to tune into the games when they are putting on a display of bad baseball every night. Getting swept at home by the NATS!!! And the Marlins are coming in next? I am as optimistic as any other baseball fan, but this team is horrible. 100 losses easy.

Posted by Nick T

8:06 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Hey Bailout,
That team you would build on the cheap with no gimmicks???...It's already been done....I think they're called the Oakland A's...


Posted by AK1984

8:07 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Here are some of the, uh, moves that should happen tomorrow.

1. Designate Arthur Rhodes, Jamie Burke, RIchie Sexson, Miguel Cairo, Willie Bloomquist, and Jose Vidro for assignment; subsequently, recall Eric O'Flaherty, Jeff Clement, Rob Johnson, Bryan LaHair, and Yung Chi Chen, while also purchasing the contract of Victor Diaz.

Here's some of the moves that should occur once Bill Bavasi and John McLaren are fired from their jobs. On an interim level, Lee Pelekoudas and John Boles ought to be their respective replacements.

2. Trade Kenji Johjima and Joe Woerman -- who'd be included in the deal to offset Johjima's recent contract extension -- to the San Diego Padres for the underperforming, injury prone Michael Barrett.

3. Trade Carlos Silva, Jarrod Washburn, and Miguel Batista to any teams that are willing to absorb the remainder of their respective contracts. With enough ballclubs out there that are desperate for pitching depth, there should be a market for those guys—especially if the return for them is nothing more than a player to be named later.

4. After trading Silva, Washburn, and Batista elsewhere, Sean White, Ryan Feierabend, and Cesar Jimenez should be recalled from the Tacoma Rainiers.

Okay, that's it.

Posted by Lucifer

8:16 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Thank you Nat and Macdoubter for posting the email addresses of the M's managerial personnel. In keeping with the spirit of your suggestion, I have written each one of them a tactful and earnest letter calling for their resignation and the dismissal of Bavasi and McLaren. In doing so, I used my real name and every ounce of tact that I could muster, likewise, I urge each of you to do likewise and give these men cause to consider their collective failure. They ought to respond to their higher conscience and act to do the right thing which is to step down from their respectful positions. These men have shamed the goodwill of Mr Yamauchi in his efforts to save baseball in Seattle. Now they ought to do the honorable thing and resign, falling on their respective swords of honor to save what little face they have.

Let me again urge all of you to follow suit and let these guys know how terrible the situation is with Mariners Baseball. Give them reason to question their failure.

Posted by A-Rod

8:18 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Bring JR. Home!

Posted by FrankBurnsEatsWorms

8:22 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Lincoln will do nothing.

Yamauchi will do nothing.

Posted by Nat

8:22 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Zona, basically, what I said in my email is: I've been a longtime fan...blah blah blah....It's time for this FO, starting with - (name 'em) - to resign and get new leadership who knows something about how a baseball organization should be run in 2008. I will not be attending anymore games...blah, blah, blah until this FO is gone, and new leadership has taken over, blah, blah, blah.

If I had an idea how to email Mr. Y I would email him as well. I do think if enough people emailed these guys it would have some impact. If nothing else, it would jam up their emails and word would get around the office. And when that's the buzz around the office maybe they would stop and think about what all these emails are saying.

Posted by jeff928

8:25 PM, Jun 15, 2008

What is Howard Lincoln waiting for? This is the worst team in baseball. Losing three straight to the Nationals is embarrassing.

Sexson has to go...if no one wants him, pay him off and send him home.
Vidro is next. Beltre can join them also.

Bedard is disappointing. Can we get anything worthwhile for him and/or Washburn?

Posted by scott

8:27 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Who do you hate more?
1. Bedard
2. Sexon
3. Bavasi
4. Willingham

We are spoiled for choices in Seattle.

Posted by Lucifer

8:28 PM, Jun 15, 2008

My letters to Seattle Mariners Management:

Mr. Howard Lincoln
CEO Seattle Mariners

Dear Mr. Lincoln:

The circumstances with the Seattle Mariners is beyond despair, you have team poised to lose more than 100 games this season, yet your payroll is an elite $117 million, it is time that you hold the authors of the monster accountable. Respectfully please dismiss Bill Bavasi and John McLaren. It is time to deconstruct this team, move or sink the underachieving veterans, and it is imperative that you act quickly as Bavasi is a proven failure when evaluating and acquiring talent. The Mariners need a new GM who can act swiftly and competently at the trade deadline to acquire young talented prospects and evaluate the system's talent for the future. This team is a disgrace to the city of Seattle and Major League Baseball. Bill Bavasi and John McLaren are the responsible parties, please remove them as soon as possible and move to rebuild the team.

Please consider that this team disgraces Mr Yamauchi's goodwill in saving baseball in Seattle. In traditional Japanese society it is time to fall on your sword and do the right thing.


Mr. Chuck Armstrong
President of Baseball Operations
Seattle Mariners

Dear Mr. Armstrong:

Consider the failings of the Seattle Mariners this year, it is time to make some necessary changes as this team is an embarrassment to the city of Seattle and Major League Baseball. The team is on course to lose more than 100 games while have a payroll of $117 million, this is a travesty of unheard of proportions. It is a matter of great shame, as a fan of the Mariners since the Pilots left Seattle and the state went to court to acquire the Mariners, I am more ashamed of this team than any that have ever appear in previous years. The failure is not a matter of simple team motivation, it is a major failing to evaluate talent and effectively manage athletes. These failures fall directly on the GM, Mr. Bill Bavasi who has made repeated mistakes evaluating talent and mismanaging this team. Field Manager John McLaren has exhibited no leadership and very little knowledge of the game in his on field management of the team. As this team is a complete failure for 2008 and beyond if left to the guidance of these individuals, it is essential that you act quickly and decisively to terminate Mr. Bavasi who cannot be trusted to rebuild this team. Replace him now with someone who can move the overpaid and underachieving veterans via trade deadline acquisitions of rising prospects, turn this season into a talent evaluation and rebuilding era. We all would much prefer to see youth giving their best rather than seeing the aging overpaid veterans continue to fail each day. It is time, to make serious moves for the future and to do so, we need a competent GM and field Manager.

Bill Bavasi and John McLaren have brought shame on this team and to Mr Yamauchi's goodwill in owning the Mariners, it is up to you to either remove these terrible managers or to fail in your duties as President of Baseball Operations, anything less demands that you answer for the shame that has been brought upon the Seattle Mariners.


Mr. Bill Bavasi
General Manager
Seattle Mariners

Dear Mr. Bavasi:

It is with great sadness that I feel I must write to you suggesting that you do the honorable thing and resign your position as General Manager of the Seattle Mariners. You have the dubious distinction of creating a monster - the first team to lose more than 100 games while having a $117 million payroll. It is a shameful legacy that spoils Mr Yamauchi's goodwill in saving baseball in Seattle. As a fan Seattle baseball ever since the Pilots, I have never been so ashamed of a team as this year Mariners. The moves you have made as GM are grand failures, which have put the team in a losing mode for years to come. This team shames the city of Seattle, Major League Baseball and Mr. Yamauchi's good faith. There is no valor in continuing your tenure here in Seattle, please for the sake of your honor step down and resign your position. Turn the management over to a responsible underlying and give that person a chance to redeem some of your mistakes. In the process, it is essential that you dismiss John McLaren who is no field manager of note. Do the right thing and resign, you will have more honor and integrity if you do so.


John McLaren
Seattle Mariners

Dear Mr. McLaren:

As a fan of Seattle baseball since the 1969 Pilots, I have suffered through many bleak and dismissal seasons, but I am more ashamed of this team than any who have come before it, There is the very likely prospect of earning the most unenviable distinction as the first team to lose 100 plus games while have a $117 million payroll. This team of overpaid, underachieving veterans and aging athletes is a shameful spectacle. It is time to put an end to the misery. For your part, I am sorry to say that I do not see managerial leadership worthy of the merit and this losing season unfortunately falls heavily on your shoulders. While I am sure by your demeanor that you are a wonderful person, I fear that I have no confidence in your ability to manage a major league baseball team. The continuation of this debacle piles shame high upon Mr Yamauchi's goodwill in saving baseball in Seattle. Given such shame, it is time you do the right thing and resign your position as Manager of the Seattle Mariners.


For what it is worth, I think it best to appeal to their moral conscience rather than curse at them, but you best follow your own internal instincts. Good Luck.

Posted by Nat

8:44 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Lu- youi wrote those letters very quickly - excellent!

Posted by effen

8:50 PM, Jun 15, 2008

None of this would have happened if Sweet Lou had not left.

Posted by niner

8:51 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Wow, Washburn had Geoff's coveted "accountability". Won't the instantly make the Mariners better?

What? No it won't? Oh well, at least it gives fodder for interviews, which is what is really behind Geoff's calls for "accountability".

That is unless you're a fellow Canadian, alleged #1 starter who is too much of a pansy to throw more than 100 pitches.

Posted by Lucifer

8:56 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Many of you suggest bringing up players from Tacoma that are perhaps not worthy of note, when there are others in the system that might better make the jump. My point is that a Bryan LaHair might be our triple A first baseman, however, there are two double AA guys - Thomas Hubbard .360 BA, 1.059 OPS with 5 HRs and 31 RBIs in 39 games and Johan Limonta .303 BA, .904 OPS, 2 HRs, 18 RBIs in 34 games - both of whom might be better suited for the M's than LaHair.

In terms of infielders, Tug Hulett .280 BA, .765 OPS, 12 2Bs, 20 RBIs in 50 games and Oswaldo Navarro .277 BA, .713 OPS, 11 2Bs, 13 RBIs in 53 games might far better serve the team than Chen or Tuiasosopo who do not appear ready for promotion.

As for outfielders, Prentice Redman, Josh Womack and Victor Diaz appear to be much better bets that Jimerson.

At any rate, get rid of Bavasi and McLaren so as to move to a trade and acquisition period with player development in building for the future, we might do well to serve a cup of coffee to some of these guys from the minors during the rest of the season.

Posted by macdoubter

9:11 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Thanks Lucifer, what would we do without ya!

I had already sent out my emails earlier, but I liked yours, so I sent a second batch.

Even if it doesn't do any good, I feel better having sent it. Everyone should. Who knows what might happen.

Posted by kaseyswagger

9:17 PM, Jun 15, 2008

We need a front office overhaul which will lead to a team overhaul.

If the team rebuilds right now (This Season)Bavasi has to go because you cannot trust the guy who got you into this mess to build your team up again.

And you have to fire Mclaren and get a proven Manager for next year.Bavasi has to go to dont get me wrong its just a matter of during the season or after.

And getting rid of Armstrong to.

Posted by Mary Jean

9:26 PM, Jun 15, 2008

McLaren and his coaching buddies look so non-chalant when the tv cameras shows them in the dugout during games. When McLaren is interviewed after the games its just more lame excuses.

There is zero passion in that dugout to win and winning is what it is all about.

Please, we need some new and younger baseball blood in the dugout. A GM, coach and staff that will light a fricken fire under this team.

Think about trading some of the pieces now while there is some value since this pathetic team is going nowhere.

But first, the front office is ulitmately responsibe for this pathetic performance. They need to go now.

Posted by Andrew

9:30 PM, Jun 15, 2008

THIS JUST IN!!!! ERIK BEDARD HAD BEEN TRADED TO OAKLAND. He was traded for Joe Blanton and three minor league catchers. When asked why, Bavasi replied, "Well, you can never have enough good catchers in the minor leagues.

Posted by Sounders

9:36 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Baghead Nation releases the following statement;

Mariners FO. Resign immediately. You know who you are. Submit to the indomitable will of Baghead Nation. Crawl back into your rat holes or we will crush you. Do it now.

Posted by Sounders

9:37 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Blanton can give Silva a run for his money at the buffet table

Posted by jk

9:40 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Time to sit down with everyone and take inventory of who WANTS to be here and who does not, that includes Ichiro. If players do not want to be here, they have 2 choices, agree to be traded to any team or be cut by the end of the week.... I would rather see Willie Bloomquist every day because he busts his ass and will give anything to be a major leaguer and frankly his passion would be contagious. There are too many guys who would give anything to get to the big leagues that wasting our time on a baby that will only throw 100 pitches is just a travesty. Time to give everyone from Howard Lincoln on down the ultimatum...if you want to be here show it, if not get the hell out.

Posted by Nicko

9:44 PM, Jun 15, 2008

i agree, if guys like willie and cairo are allowed to play more their passion and desire and grit will surely be better than the crap we have now. im sure willie would bust his balls more than lopez and yuni who are complacenet. mb even ichiro and beltre

Posted by Andrew

9:48 PM, Jun 15, 2008

That Boston series here at home was the best I've seenthe M's play all year. The defense was stellar. And guess who was playing 1st base. Cairo. Sexson brings everyone else down. Get rid of him now. At least Cairo tries his hardest all the time.

Posted by Andrew

9:49 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Oh and Lucifer, great e mails, it's inspired me to write some also. Repercussions must happen.

Posted by SoCal M's Fan

10:00 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Anyway we could boycott a game entirely? Any chance that we get the people of Seattle to unite, stand together, and have no one show up for a home game? What if no one went to one of our home games? I'm not talking about 5,000 or 10,000 people and that's it - I'm talking no one attends at all! What if the mariners show up to play and the stadium is empty!!

Posted by Sounders

10:01 PM, Jun 15, 2008

At least we won't have to listen to any more 'votes of confidence' by the FO regarding Bavasi.

Could you imagine how laughable that would be now?

"We have complete faith in our GM. This is not a management issue, this is a player issue."

Posted by Herfis McGrunkypants

10:01 PM, Jun 15, 2008

OMG you people are crazy.
You'd rather see a guy who is hitting .160 play more because he works really hard and really wants to be major leaguer.
News Flash.... This kind of thinking is exactly why we are in this mess.
If his 'Atta Boy attitude was that contagious, the whole team would be riding a wave of Willie Fever.
He was undeservedly anointed our utility man in 2003, and played around 80 games. He's played more than 80 games every year since then. During which time, I feel it fair to say, we have brutally sucked.
Yet, he plays more and more... and the fans, for some absurd reason, are happy with that.
What [i]should[/i] be happening, is the franchise should be somehow, someway, be conjuring some kind of plan that would result in a team that did not have to waste space on the 25-man roster with anyone who can't hit over .200.... much less two guys, one making major dough, one taking up major playing time.
Good lord, yous guys. Have some expectations! Have some sense of pride! Have a clue!
Willie. Bloomquist. Sucks.
And no team with him on their major league roster is serious about anything, nor do they have a clue what they are doing.

Posted by adrewgolfsalot

10:08 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Howard, Chuck, Bill, John,

I've tried to be a Mariner fan this year. I've really tried.

I live in Washington, DC. I have the Extra Innings package and watch the Mariners whenever they're on, even if it requires staying up to 1 AM to do so.

I've been a Mariner fan my entire life, but I just can't take it anymore. I'll continue to root for the team and all, but I won't be purchasing any Mariners memorablia, attending any Mariners games, or any other way contributing to the operations of my beloved franchise.

For me, it's not about the losing. It's about the lack of logic displayed mostly by you, but also by the remainder of management.

I don't advocate, necessarily the firing of anyone as I think that's mean-spirited, but I can't help but think that anyone else at this point would be a better option that what we currently have.

Let me explain what I mean by "lack of logic."

1) This offseason you signed Carlos Silva to a 4 year 48 million dollar contract. In prior offseasons you gave lucrative deals to the likes of Miguel Batista and Jarrod Washburn. Each of these three pitchers have the same pedigree. They don't walk many, they don't strike out many, and they generally pitch to contact. By signing the three of them and making them 60% of our rotation, you, basically, were telling us, the fans, that this was your philosophy as to how to prevent runs from scoring.

This season, you've assembled a lineup of guys who don't walk, ever, rarely strike out (Richie Sexson excluded), and hit for contact. Apparently you believe this is an effective way to score runs.

I don't understand how there's not a very visible logical disconnect here.

2) Time and time again the on field management is horiffic. For example, down by two, with a man on first in the ninth inning, Miguel Cairo, who couldn't hit a ball to the warning track if it were on a tee pinch hits for Jeff Clement, who albeit was struggling, has some pop in his bat. For example with nobody out and down by two, runners at first and second, in the seventh inning Saturday night, Yuniesky Betancourt strode to the plate and proceeded to attempt to lay down a sacrifice bunt. Regardless of what transpired here (he struck out as we all know), let's just assume he had succeeded in laying down the bunt. Ichiro would have been up with one down and runners at second and third. Surely the Nationals would have walked Ichrio, thereby taking the bat out of the hands of our best hitter. So why the decision to bunt with Yuni in the first place? What logic is there behind either of these moves?

3) Jeremy Reed is a great defensive outfielder. He's no greater than average with the bat, but the kid can play defense. Raul Ibanez cannot play defense. So, if the team is looking for a new option at first base, what's the most logical thing to do? Have Ibanez play first, seeing how as he already knows how and has played there before. What do the Mariners do? Have Reed take time to learn how to play first, where his bat will be horribly below league average for offensive output from a first baseman and where his defense will be of a much lower value. Meanwhile, Raul Ibanez will still be roaming left field turning outs into hits.

4) Jeff Clement was drafted with the third overall pick in the 2005 amatuer draft. Jeff Clement is a well above average hitter as a catcher. Jeff Clement is nothing more than average, and likely below average as an offensive threat at first base. Thus, what's the logical thing to do to get the most out of Jeff Clement? Surely not pigeonhole him into a role as a 1b/DH type by re-signing a catcher mired in an abysmal downturn. What did the Mariners do? Exactly that.

5) Brandon Morrow has a hell of an arm. The 2008 season is lost. How is it logical to continue to keep him in the bullpen when he could be developed into what could be a quality starter down the road?

6) Great bullpens don't matter if your starting pitching can't keep you in games. Great bullpens don't matter if your offense can't score you more than one or two runs a game. Why then did we spend our first round pick on a closer out of the University of Georgia, who has one hell of an arm, but won't be valuable to this club anywhere in the near future?

7) Along these lines, two years ago, in the 2006 amatuer draft, the team drafted the aforementioned Morrow with the fifth overall pick, passing on the college player of the year Tim Licecum. The reasons cited for this, at the time, were that a) Morrow was a much bigger (physically) guy than Lincecum who stands at 5'11" and is therefore likely more dependable from an injury sense; b) Morrow would be ready for the Major Leagues earlier than Lincecum and would help the team more so than the local boy, the pitcher out of the University of Washington.

Tim Lincecum is one of the ten best pitchers, maybe even five, in the National League right now. He's an early Cy Young candidate. Brandon Morrow is mired as a setup guy for a team that is 21 games under .500; oh, and he's waking up with a sore shoulder. Here's a list of Lincecum's injury worries:

8) Remember what I wrote about Lincecum being small and not a big enough guy to draft in 2006? The guy you drafted in 2008, Josh Fields, he's 6'0" and that's generous.

9) Jeff Clement played his first game in the Major Leagues in 2008 on April 30. He was sent down to AAA Tacoma after the game on May 16. Over this 16 game stretch, Clement was miserable, hitting .167 / .286 / .250. The decision to send him down was to move Jose Vidro back into the DH slot. What did Vidro do to deserve this? Well, over that same 16 game stretch, he had a scorching bat, coming in at .167 / .167 / .167 -- not drawing a single walk, nor getting a single extra base hit.

I can stand losing. I can stand being a bad team. But I can't stand making decision after decision that don't seem to fit together.

I sincerely hope the organization gets it back on the right track sooner rather than later.

Posted by Patrick F.

10:09 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Prediction: McClaren is fired by Monday morning. Bavasi stays on for the rest of the year.

Posted by jk

10:34 PM, Jun 15, 2008

McGrumpyPants--- I am not advocating that Willie be a permanent fixture on this team by any means. I am just stating that at THIS point, with a group of guys who quite frankly look like they do not give a damn, who have been way to many opportunities to turn this thing around, I would rather watch AAA guys and players who want to play ball this year as opposed to an A-hole that takes himself out of games after 100 pitches. Would you rather watch Richie strike out for the 800th time and trot back to the dugout or would you rather watch a guy that may suck just as bad but at leasts busts his ass? Next year, I agree lets get some bad asses in here and I do not care if they are all A-holes so long as they know how to win.

Posted by Faceplant

10:36 PM, Jun 15, 2008

"In terms of infielders, Tug Hulett .280 BA, .765 OPS, 12 2Bs, 20 RBIs in 50 games and Oswaldo Navarro .277 BA, .713 OPS, 11 2Bs, 13 RBIs in 53 games might far better serve the team than Chen or Tuiasosopo who do not appear ready for promotion."

I don't think Hulett has the bat to play regularly, and doesn't have the defensive versatilty to be a reserve infielder. Navarro can play just about every infield position, as can Chen. But Chen has been a big dissapointment with the bat. Nobody expected him to carry a big stick, but his bat has been unexpectedly anemic. Navarro is what he is.

"As for outfielders, Prentice Redman, Josh Womack and Victor Diaz appear to be much better bets that Jimerson."

Prentice Redman is complete garbage. This is the guy who last year posted a .245/.347/.423 line in long season A ball as a 28 year old.

Josh Womack posted a .591 OPS in an injury shortened season in long season A ball last year. It's going to take more than 11 games for me to believe he's anything more than he was last year.

Victor Diaz is interesting. He has similar problems as Balentien in that he can't hit a breaking ball to save his life, but he has some pop in his bat, and could be useful stick off the bench. He offers no defensive value at all.

Jimerson is an all or nothing guess hitter who doesn't walk, and averaged almost a strikeout and a half a game. But at least he's a threat on the basepaths, and isn't a total disaster on defense. I'd certainly take him over Prentice Redman, or Josh Womack.

Posted by bammy

10:38 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Thanks for the email addresses. I just fired off one to Billy Bunghole.


I know your seat is getting warmer by the game but for those of us who care about the Mariners and their future please don't make any trades. You have been fleeced in every deal you have made. Whatever method you use to evaluate talent is about as effective as a Horacio Ramirez fastball. Please stop making decisions. Save face and move on. With any luck you will land another GM gig to improve your legacy. If Mariner fans have any luck that next gig will be in our division.

Best of luck.

Posted by Pshrg

10:42 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Please, somebody, FIRE someone already. Gaaah.

The Nationals sweep was not the most infuriating moment of the year for me. It's hard to get infuriated at a series sweep when you refuse to watch it.

No, the most infuriating moment would be when Bavasi said McLaren's job was safe. There have been no repercussions for losing, therefore no fear, therefore no effort. Meanwhile M's fans' intelligence gets insulted by team management's perverse public need to keep reassuring themselves.

Some local journalists seem to be a little critical about fans demanding a "sacrifice" for this year's lost season. And maybe they'd have a point if this weren't the sixth (maybe seventh) consecutive lost season. This isn't a team with that edginess of a winner; it's the skeleton crew of a Staples on a Saturday afternoon.

I am so sick, exhausted and worst of all, apathetic about all of this. Somebody please shake us out of this all-too-typical passive/aggressive team. Frankly, losing Bavasi, McLaren, Sexson and putting fear in Armstrong wouldn't feel like much of a sacrifice to me. I'd start watching again, at least.

Posted by KC

10:45 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Obviously this team needs to be blown up and re-built from scratch (starting with the FO). Hell, the Florida Marlins have won the World Series (twice!) and blown up their roster (twice!) and continue to come back in a few years and be competitive. But they didn't do it just by dumping their underperforming high salary guys. They trade guys like Sheffield, A.J. Burnett, Josh Beckett, etc when they're at the top of their games and get quality youth in return. Other than Clement and Morrow, I'd look to trade anyone who you can get real value for first. That means Bedard, Felix, Beltre and Ichiro (even though ownership would never trade Ichiro for understandable reasons.) They've all shown that they have simply gotten used to losing and it doesn't bother them any more. Hence . . . they are LOSERS.
- We crowned "King Felix" four years ago as the next Dwight Gooden and certain Cy Young winner. Instead he's fantastic for two or three starts, average for two or three starts, and then gets blown out for a couple starts. I don't doubt he'll be awesome somewhere else, but he's never gonna be a winner here. Get a new GM who can evaluate talent and trade Felix for 2 or 3 top line minor leaguers who can be ready in 2-3 years.
- Bedard has shown in his short time here that he hasn't got the guts or the ability to be a true #1 stopper on a winning team. I've got serious doubt about how good of a teamate he is too. Trade him while he still has upside and we can get something good in return.
- I think Beltre is a warrior and tries his guts out, but other than one great year in LA he's never been better than an average hitter with occasional power. Can play D, some National League team would scoop him up and maybe be willing to part with some decent talent to get him.

Washburn, Silva, Betancourt, Lopez, Johjima and maybe Raul would probably fetch some decent return. Not can't miss studs, but maybe a surprise here or there. Wash is about done, but is left-handed. Silva could probably be decent on a team that could give him 5 runs. I don't know what the hell is wrong with Betancourt but he seems to have regressed since he's become our everyday starter. Somebody probably thinks they could get him to play to his potential and would trade for him. Lopez and Joh have shown enough in the past to fetch something.
The Sexson's and Vidro's of the team should just be DFA's or traded for a few rosin bags and a carton of baseballs (and we'd be getting a steal if we could get that for them).
Blow this thing up and start from scratch. I too would rather see young guys busting their ass to make it in the majors than a bunch of pampered losers waiting to fulfill all this "potential" we've been hearing about for years.


Posted by Bored Stiff Timeline

10:46 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Bavasi gets fired and all the trash is dumped out. 6-16-08 1
11111111 1
11 1 1
1 1 1
1 1 1
1111 1 1 Mac Gets Fired
1 1 1 1 1
1 1 1-Hargrove Resigns1 1
1 1 1 1 1
1 1111 1 1
1 1 1
1 1
1 1
End of '07------ 1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
1 1
getting swept by Nats1 1
1 1

Posted by doug

10:49 PM, Jun 15, 2008


Posted by george dickel

10:52 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Axe 'em all!! Bring on the Hawks

Posted by AK1984

10:54 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Why does damn near everyone figuratively fellate Tim Lincecum?

Undoubtedly, Brandon Morrow was a horrendous selection with the 5th pick in the 2007 MLB Draft. That, however, is 'cause Andrew Miller should've been the choice.

Although Miller would've been a costly acquisition -- since as a draftee he earned a four-year, $5.5 million contract with a $3.55 million signing bonus from the Detroit TIgers -- he'd've definitely been worth it.

Anyone who claims that Lincecum was a higher rated prospect than Miller is not only using hindsight, but also deluding themselves. They're all probably homers, too, which is the mentality of many casual fans around the Pacific Nortwest.

All right, I got that off of my chest.

Posted by DH

10:55 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Im tired of all the willie bashing. You know for a fact if we had a roster full of guys with his drive and effort and attitude we would be doing much better. He plays the game the right way, unlike our most of our guys.

Posted by Jared

10:58 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Mr Yamauchi needs to put down his Nintendo Wii and start canning these idiots in the FO. This just sucks. The worst mariner year that i have experienced. and can we please get rid of Erik Bedard.

Wii would like to play!

Posted by cw

11:03 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Sonics Rally 4:30 Monday

Posted by Sounders

11:12 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Calm down doug. Bedard is a good pitcher. Not great, but also not the reason the team sux. THAT comes from the trickle down effect from the FO.

Posted by Adam

11:16 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Fun fact of the night:

In order to get back to .500 by the end of the year, the Mariners will have to play .612 ball over their last 93 games. That's a better winning percentage than that 29 of the 30 ML teams have so far this year (Chicago Cubs).

If the M's want to beat the Angels' pace of 97 wins, they will need to play .790 ball.

Posted by AK1984

11:18 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Erik Bedard, Jose Lopez, Yuniesky Betancourt, and Adrian Beltre have felt the wrath of folks around the blogosphere for several different reasons. Yet, that notwithstanding, none of those guys should be placed on the trading block -- if at all for that matter -- until this off-season. At that point in time, it'll be easier to field offers from other organizations for them -- as well as judge their potential return value -- plus, Bill Bavasi will have hopefully been fired by then.

Right now, however, the focus should be on designated the deadweight (i.e., Arthur Rhodes, Jamie Burke, Richie Sexson, Miguel Cairo, Willie Bloomquist, and Jose Vidro) for assignment, while also attempting to trade players whose contracts are albatrosses (Carlos Silva, Jarrod Washburn, Miguel Batista, and Kenji Johjima).

Why, by the way, are worthless non-prospects like Anderson Garcia, Tracey Thorpe, Jared Wells, and Joe Woerman taking up space on the 40-man roster? Hell, those scrubs make Jake Woods seem like a useful pitcher. Also, Sean White, Ryan Feierabend, Eric O'Flaherty, Cesar Jimenez, Rob Johnson, Bryan LaHair, Victor Diaz, and Yung Chi Chen aren't long-term answers by any stretch of the imagination; yet, in the meantime, they're all capable of being stopgaps this season. Sans Jeff Clement, there isn't one high-ranking prospect ready to play full-time in the majors.

Posted by Sounders

11:48 PM, Jun 15, 2008


Nice analysis of the Bavasi method. I said it before, his and the FO's strategy and philosophy is one of low risk/low reward. Their main criteria for going after guys is not talent but are they durable or not, which basically send a message to the team that "you're not good enough but if the other teams players get hurt we will have a chance. "

That is the philosophy of LOSERS

Posted by MarkB

11:54 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Interesting predictions Larry.

Here's mine: Nothing will happen tomorrow, this week, this month or this season. Why mess up the chance now to make history?

*first team with a $116 million payroll to lose 116 games!!!!!

It was for sure more fun when we were winning 116 games, but even then the management of this team didn't really have a clue about how to be playoff ready...

Posted by Sounders

12:05 AM, Jun 16, 2008

I predict it will be 40 years before before the Mariners have another winning season. That's how long it took to get from The Monorail (first good idea) to Light Rail (next good idea).

Posted by Dave from the coast

12:28 AM, Jun 16, 2008

The 2008 Seattle Mariners team is the baseball equivalent of the Hindenberg disaster: "OH, THE HUMANITY!!!

Posted by dumb bloggers

12:59 AM, Jun 16, 2008

To wtf and the rest of you assholes about not attending games: Many of us love baseball and as such purchased tix way before the season...yeah it's awful we suck but who is gonna reimburse us, you assholes? So shut the fuck up about going to the games idiot

Posted by Blair

1:33 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Interesting link on stating Bedard threw 110 pitches 10 times last year for Baltimore.
Geoff/Larry do you have an idea why is limiting himself to 100 now? A few weeks ago he threw 110. Is it an injury fear? Those 10-15 pitches could really help sometimes.

For the team as a whole I don't know. My friend and I were talking about who to keep and the list we came up with was Felix, Clement, RRS (his addition), Morrow. Anybody else on this roster a must have? I've been a big Ichiro fan for years but he's expensive and getting older and his hits first obsession sometimes seems to get in the way of what the team actually needs. The biggest example is something I personally haven't seen this year but have seen in the past - when he bunts with a man on and 2 outs. As the team's best hitter a run producing hit is what is needed, not another hit for his total and passing the buck to the next (less talented) man in the lineup. I do like his stealing this year though.
While not agreeing with the word choices of "Dumb Bloggers" above me I do agree in that I enjoy going to the games to watch it played at the major league level. It's the guys being called out for lack of caring that bugs me when the tickets/concessions/parking prices are so high.

Posted by Bums

3:02 AM, Jun 16, 2008

I still don't believe there will be any repercussions. Things will continue on as they have with weird fantasies of some amazing comeback. Lincoln and Armstrong don't care about boos, they only care about empty seats. Sexson may even get bumped to the 3 hole like Vidro had for several games not that he can see. This is such a pathetic collection of players. Good job Bavasi, can't wait to see how you try to correct this next year.

Posted by Bums

3:02 AM, Jun 16, 2008

I still don't believe there will be any repercussions. Things will continue on as they have with weird fantasies of some amazing comeback. Lincoln and Armstrong don't care about boos, they only care about empty seats. Sexson may even get bumped to the 3 hole like Vidro had for several games not that he can see. This is such a pathetic collection of players. Good job Bavasi, can't wait to see how you try to correct this next year.

Posted by Bums

3:11 AM, Jun 16, 2008

I still don't believe there will be any repercussions. Things will continue on as they have with weird fantasies of some amazing comeback. Lincoln and Armstrong don't care about boos, they only care about empty seats. Sexson may even get bumped to the 3 hole like Vidro had for several games now that he can see. This is such a pathetic collection of players. Good job Bavasi, can't wait to see how you try to correct this next year.

Posted by AKMariner

4:30 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Oh how these M's do suck!! I know it won't happen, but it needs to be done. Fire the ENTIRE FRONT OFFICE!
Mr. Yamouchi of Nintendo, please cast a glance at this train wreck of an organization that you own and save us once more. A house cleaning is long over due.
Howard Lincoln/Chuck Armstrong are as misguided/clueless as could possibly be and they need to be the first to go!

Posted by Mr. X

5:56 AM, Jun 16, 2008

The question is, will McLaren bench a certain disgruntled outfielder for two "little league" baserunning blunders in consecutive games, or will it just be business as usual? You can't give the other team, even Washington, gifts like two baserunning outs. Worst baserunner on the team, by a mile.

Posted by ableman42

6:00 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Fire Mclaren now and Bavasi ASAP.

Lose, in anyway possible, Sexon and Bautista and maybe Johjima- if you can get anything for them, great.

Clement should be playing 1b of catcher every day or at a minimum playing against righties.

Platoon Reed and Balentin or DH Ibanez and play both.

Stop screwing around with the lineup. Pick one, or a vs. lefties and a vs. righties. I'd prefer Ichi, Lopez, Ibanez, Beltre, Clement..

Posted by Mr. X

6:12 AM, Jun 16, 2008

The precedent has already been set with Betancourt. Ichiro's repeated brain flatulence on the basepaths need to be corrected. The only thing is, I'm not sure that benching him will do any good. Maybe Mac could send in a pinch runner for him after a few late-inning hits. It might send more of a message than a day off ever could. Adam Jones would have never made those baserunning blunders.

Posted by go4theteam

6:18 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Like I said before: The lineup
Ichiro CF
Lopez 2nd
Ibanez 1st
Clement DH
Beltre 3rd
Reed RF
Johnson C
Belentien LF
Bentencourt SS
Bloomquist Every day filling in for a rest day
Conclusion: This team now wins---

Posted by Brian

6:54 AM, Jun 16, 2008

As long as the Mariners have owners who do not come to the ball park and only see the profit/loss numbers, I do not see anything happening. It is a business venture, not a sports team they love. Unlike their fans.

The big problem is by the time they catch on, it may be too late. They will have lost fans who will be very long in returning, if they return at all. Then there will be no money to pay players, and we will be back to the Mariners of the '80's.

It is for this reason the changes need to be from the top down. Including finding new owners who will care about the team.

Posted by byebyeSexson

7:13 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Maybe John and Bill will agree to go quietly if Howard will promise to hire someone dedicated to playing and keeping Richie...


Posted by byebyeSexson

7:25 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Answer to your inquiry:
"8:27 PM, Jun 15, 2008

Who do you hate more?
1. Bedard
2. Sexon
3. Bavasi
4. Willingham"

I like Willingham (and Romar too). I don't hate any of the above, but I would donate money for a bus trip out of town for Richie. He's my number One! Realisticly, it would help the team more if Bavasi left so he's a strong Number Two. I would only let Bedard go if i got a lot in return. He would win a lot of games on a fairly good team.


Posted by Court Jester

7:37 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Someone shoot this horse PLEASE. It's terrible watching it flail around like the disaster it is.

Posted by Top pick in 09 draft

7:40 AM, Jun 16, 2008

My prediction for this week's sacrifice to appease the fans temporarily is that Big K is tagged with DFA with Clement being recalled. Clement was not in the Rainier's lineup yesterday and Big K also sat even though he has hit Tim Redding very well in the past. The list of sacrifices made is slowly moving up in order from role player (Baek) to coach (Pentland) to second-highest paid player (Sexson). The noose will then be heading towards Mac, Bonehead Bill then to Armstrong in progression.

Posted by eastcoast

8:06 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Just when you believe it the mariners can't succeed in getting any worse, they actually do. It is probably the only thing they have succeeded in doing this year.

Can anyone explain, how in the name of all that is holy, do the M's draw 105,000 for this weekends series with the lowly Nats. As many have pointed out, cash in the bank = no rush to change.

There is an article on that indicates the Cubs have contacted the M's regarding interest in Bedard. Upon reading that, my first thought was Bavasi has to be fired, and right now. We can not let this man orchestrate one more single transaction for this "organization". He has to go NOW!!

Secondly, Mac needs to go. He does not deserve to manage this team for the rest of the year. Granted, this season is not his fault. However, he has obviously not maximized his production from what he has. He, like Bavasi, appears to have no plan when managing a game. I, like many others, are sometimes baffled by his in-game decisions. He clearly is not in control of this team, and is more interested in being a friend than a manager. He has to go before we (as an organization) screw up any more young players like Clement, Reed, and Wlad. They need to have someone to take them under their wings and tutor them - NOW!

Sexson and Vidro must go! Regardless of whether this team is paralyzed by indecision, these are easy decisions. The season is lost, Sexson and Vidro will not be back. Kick them to the curb, let the kids play, we need to start evaluating what we have available for 2009 - and their is no better time than now. Start with these changes and see how the team responds. Do any future leaders emerge? Further changes can be made based on the results. But lets use these 100 or so games to evaluate for next year. We are simply wasting valuable time by sending out the same crap night after night. Of course, this is the one area in which I feel sorry for McLaren - he sits Sexson and Yuni... who does he have to replace them... Cairo and Willie.. Good Lord!

Finally, are their any past M's in the coaching pipeline? Not neccessarily a manager, but someone like Edgar and Buhner - who could maybe bring a little pride to the clubhouse. Anyone?

Posted by Samurai I Am Awry

8:11 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Lot more fans of Bobbleheads than Baseball in Seattle.

So it's monday morning - - - what's going to happen?

Posted by jro

8:18 AM, Jun 16, 2008

No way, Larry. Even though they've run out of options, the team doesn't have the guts to do it.

Armstrong has already yelled at the coaching staff.
Bavasi has already called out the players as pansies.
Mclaren has already had a meltdown.
The players have already pointed a few fingers.

In all scenarios, the response has been the same...lackluster indifference. When was the last time anyone in the organization (A-N-Y-O-N-E) took a loss as their burden, their guilt? No one. This is the MLB's version of not-my-department. From the players to the coaches to the front office, this is the worst organization in baseball, period.

In any normal world scenario, this band of merry men would have been summarily dispatched. However, in the land of entitlement, devoid of logic and accountability, they sit on their hands.

There's only one person left who can make a positive difference -- Mr. Lincoln. He can still salvage his reputation. Otherwise, he's destined to join the likes of Chuck and Bill as world-class incompetents.

Given this organization's "not-my-fault" brand of leadership, getting rid of those guys shouldn't be too tough a task.

Posted by clevesc

8:40 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Question - why don't the Mariners have an African American position player? Are they the only team to have such a line up?

Posted by JuneauTom

8:51 AM, Jun 16, 2008

It seems as though every time that I turn the T.V. on to watch the Mariners, Jose Vidro hits a 305' fly ball with runners on base. Doesn't ever seem to get a hit when I watch. I wonder how many runners he has left on base?

Posted by eastcoast

9:02 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Perhaps even more disheartening than our W-L record, is the fact that our organization is exceedingly thin on talent. There are few, if any, MLB ready guys in the minors. Probably the brightest spot is future starting pitching, with the potential for Felix, Morrow, and Aumont. However, the prospects for position players are dismal. On top of that, we have few commodities with which to make substantial trades. I would suggest that anyone on the current M's roster is tradeable except Felix. I will also add Ichiro because he will never be traded (japanese ownership, brings in huge revenue from Japan, etc.). As for guys like Ibanez, Lopez.. wait for a hot streak, then make deals to maximize return. That is, of course, if BB is no longer GM.

Posted by ethan

9:07 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Japanese ownership is thinking right now of having DVD Hentai night....
anything to keep the serfs in the seats.

Posted by brad643dp

9:07 AM, Jun 16, 2008

None of those guys should survive.. Right now, the franchise as whole is an embarrassment. I also agree that Lincoln should be gone as well.

Posted by Nat

9:15 AM, Jun 16, 2008

For all you Willie lovers- even Willie wants to bail!

I like Willie just fine as a person and I'd like to see if he can make it in the NL. Other than that I have no vested interest in anything he does.

But the question is: who will Novice write about when Willie goes to the NL?

Posted by hear here

9:15 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Just for the record, the crowd (myself included) wasn't booing the team -- we were booing the umps for that home run call. To everyone there, it clearly looked foul. However unhappy we are with the team, yesterday's boos were due to unhappiness with the umps.

Posted by Resin isn't Cheating

9:17 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Tim just has an odd delivery which will be figured out and he will be dontrelle'd out of the bigs back to single A soon enough.

Nonsense, most ridiculous thing I've read outside USSM claiming the M's are lying about employing two sabermetricians on staff.

Dontrelle's velocity dropped, he doesn't have an out-pitch, that's why the league figured him out.

Lincecum was the best pitcher in the draft IMO when passed up for Morrow. Tim has a wicked out pitch, and his velocity is in the high 90's unlike Willis.

Posted by Edgar

11:22 AM, Jun 16, 2008

Please wear a paper bag over your head next time you visit Safeco.

And please SOME ONE fire Bavasi. Please. His wonderous list of blunder since 2003, have cost this orginization too much. Armstrong and Lincoln need to be axed by the end of the year as well. If those two were half as intertested with what the team does ON the field instead of what their players do off it, they might be able to pick up, or keep, good talent.

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