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Geoff Baker covers the Mariners for The Seattle Times. He provides daily coverage of the team throughout spring training, and during the season.

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May 23, 2008 8:46 PM

Start spreading the news...

Posted by Geoff Baker

ny0523.jpg

The Mariners stink

They went down 13-2 to the New York Yankees tonight in a game as ugly as any of the previous three. I don't think that, on paper, they are this bad. But in reality, right now, they look awful.

That's four blowouts in a row and counting. The Mariners truly should not expect a Christmas invite from the McLaren family next December. This game had it all once again, with a crooked-number inning when the Yankees put up eight runs in the fifth. A ton of hits. The usual defensive miscues. Losing arguments with the umpire. Nine strikeouts in six innings by Andy Pettitte, the most he's put up in two years.

"Playing on this team and seeing what is happening around me, I feel that something is beginning to fall apart,'' Ichiro said, through a translator. "But, if I was not in this situation, and I was objectively watching what just happened this week, I would probably be drinking a lot of beers and booing.''

Ichiro wouldn't say what exactly is falling apart, but invited reporters to draw their own conclusions. He's not happy with what's gone on here. Nobody is. But some guys are contributing more than others.

The starting rotation has collapsed. The 4 1/3 innings by Erik Bedard tonight was actually the most by any Seattle starter on the road trip. Seattle has been outscored 43-16 in those four games.

Bedard insisted he wasn't distracted by Jason Giambi drawing a walk on a close pitch in the at-bat before a Shelley Duncan homer in the second gave New York the lead for good. Bedard said he'd put the walk out of his mind, something he learned to do long ago as a starter.

"You have to,'' Bedard said. "If you let them get in your head, you might have a bad inning.''

Turns out, the bad inning came in the fifth. That's now two starts in the last three where Bedard let his team down. He's just as guilty as any of the other starting five when it comes to the rotation's collapse. At this point, though, analyzing individual games is almost pointless. This season has collapsed. This team is showing no signs of being able to compete for more than a handful of innings. There is no cohesiveness. No coming together of all aspects of the game.

John McLaren is running out of things to say.

"None of us are happy about this,'' McLaren said. "I really don't know what to say about it. We're in a funk and we can only get out of it ourselves. We've had a lot of meetings and I don't think meetings are the answer right now.''

This group is playing like a team that's out of answers. And in McLaren's case, likely out of time.

Don't go taking Ichiro's advice and drowning your sorrows in beer. Here, enjoy this video instead, a tour of Yankee Stadium. You'll see the new stadium being built across the street, then go inside the old place, the one I'm now sitting in, with me. We'll trek across the field to visit Monument Park, beyond the fence in left center. We'll also tour the visiting team's bullpen area. Enjoy.

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Posted by Batter Up!!!

7:11 PM, May 23, 2008

And Everyone quitting including Bedar...d

Posted by First Man

7:15 PM, May 23, 2008

Truly pathetic! What about my theory that this team is cursed. Maybe Clay Bennett is behind this curse against Seattle. Might we send it back to him and purify our team and equipment with cedar smudge?

Posted by scottM

7:15 PM, May 23, 2008

Row, row, row your skid, gently down the stream
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily we need a whole new team.

Posted by Corey Miller

7:17 PM, May 23, 2008

Its really disheartening when you think you have the answer byfiring the manager, trading a player, DFA'ing a guy...until you look at the next option? Who do you hire? Who do you trade for when there isnt anyone available? Who do you DFA when you have NOTHING in the minors to bring up?

Geoff put it to me straight...we are stuck with what we have for a while arent we? Is this how the Tigers felt a few years ago when they 100+ games?

Posted by knsnklip

7:19 PM, May 23, 2008

maybe, sage, cedar, sweetgrass, juniper, and .........

Posted by First Man

7:21 PM, May 23, 2008

Yes knsnklip - we need to drive the curse away, perhaps a local Native traditionalists can help us.

Posted by Bruce

7:21 PM, May 23, 2008

Geoff,
There's not much more to say about this team that hasn't been already said many times over. You've been the most entertaining part of the season. Keep up the awesome work. Sorry you have to sit through this pathetic display.

Posted by JerryP

7:23 PM, May 23, 2008

Well, now the pitchers can't blame it all on Johjima,,,,

Seriously, there is a significant flaw in character and a lack of leadership within the team

George Sherill said this past Tuesday that there was something wrong with this team's makeup.

I agree if we can them that we have, who do we bring up?
I think I'm selling off my tixs next week.

Posted by PayClayBennett

7:24 PM, May 23, 2008

Corey - THE answer is not firing the manager - that's one of the answers. Kind of like they don't walways lose only becuase they can't hit, but also because they cannot field and cannot pitch. You can't fix it all overnight, but losing Bill and Mac would be a huge boost to making somethiing happen in the right direction.

Disheartening? Yes. Realtity? Definitely. Those 2 bozos gotsta go.

Posted by dc

7:26 PM, May 23, 2008

It's over. All those months during the offseason of pondering and pontificating, anticipating what could be. The thrill of the Bedard trade......the emergence of Felix....the return of Richie....none of it matters any more. This team is terrible and has, in just a few short weeks, become the laughingstock of the major leagues.

I am not a fairweather fan. I will always follow the M's, but as I wrote earlier in the day, my interest is gone. I'm gonna pay attention to the Rainiers a little bit, and I'll always listen to Dave on the radio.....but the days of sitting down to watch and analyze the game are over.

On a side note....Rizzs mentioned early in his call of the game on the radio tonight, that Johnnie M. has tried 'everything' to get this offense going. I disagree. He has yet to fully bench Richie, he has been lenient on Johjima and Vidro, he has not moved Ichiro down in the order. All he's done is trot the same sad bunch of losers out there every night and then in the 1st or 2nd inning gets himself tossed out of the game in a feeble effort to light a spark under this pathetic group.

What a joke this has become. The inevitable firing of McLaren that will take place on Monday will not salvage this season. We need an absolute overhaul from the top down. Everyone on this team is being asked to perform at the top of their historical game....instead they mail in pathetic at bats, crappy fielding and now it's pitiful pitching. This is embarrassing. We are now officially the Pittsburgh Pirates.

I'm done.

Posted by Adios McLaren!

7:27 PM, May 23, 2008

Sign Bonds and stick him in DH. Trade Sexson for Griffey and toss some coin in for the Reds to bite. Instant offense and some old aged experience.

Posted by PayClayBennett

7:32 PM, May 23, 2008

dc - I think we're floating in the same boat, cresting the same wave. I was trying to think of who we would relate to the most - the Pirates or the Royals...but I think Pirates is the best cross reference, LOL. At least they had "We Are Family" and they're forever in history with a World Series title. 116 wins was cool, but doesn't mean as much when you don't even make the Series.

Sad days man - the Kingdome days are their way back!

Posted by faithful

7:37 PM, May 23, 2008

dc is right on. Mac hasn't come close to doiing all he could do. Bench Sexson permanently, put Reed in LF. Let R-Smith or Morrow try starting in lieu of Washedup; Batista in the bullpen where he could be effective. Bring back Clement and let him catch, Put Raul at 1B, vidro or Johjima DH. many options other than just moving the same tired few up and down the lineup.

Posted by putzy

7:37 PM, May 23, 2008

sweet baby jesus !

The bull pen sucked. then the offense sucked. the starters were good and now they suck. the bullpen is better. the offense still sucks. the defense still scuks...the manager sucks...ichiro sucks...mclanren is a bozohe's the worst...omg...

Posted by sdfserf

7:38 PM, May 23, 2008

well. at least 2 K's (Ichiro's) wre you know what

Posted by kranky

7:40 PM, May 23, 2008

dc, don't insult the Pirates. They are 22-25, a class above the Ms!

Its a shame because there are some decent elements to this team. But the bad apples seem to have spoiled the whole barrel now.

Posted by putzy

7:43 PM, May 23, 2008

to all those guys who say it's not the mangager's fault and there is nothing he can do...I answer, "bulls*** !"

I could name you thousands of mistakes he's made that has cost this team ball games... the team doesn't respect him....the players don't like him...they won't play for him...they all quite and can you blame them ? he's a knucklehead, that Mac Laren all he does is stupid moves...right down the line...from naming Bedard number one on February 15th...to naming Wilkerson starting RF'er on March 1st....do the world a favor and quit Maclaren Please, please, please dont' make me beg okay...omg

Posted by dc

7:45 PM, May 23, 2008

Hey Payclay....

In all my years of watching baseball I don't think I've ever been a fan of such a terrible team. That includes when I was a kid living in Chicago watching the Cubs and the White Sox. This is humiliating. I can't think of a Mariner team that has been this bad.....and I truly don't see it getting any better.

So....I've taken the silver lining approach. Think of how much opportunity we now have to build a team for years to come. Nobody on this team should be untouchable. Imagine the talent we'd be offered for the likes of Bedard, Ibanez, Beltre, Putz, etc. Even Ichiro. Look, the Mariners have individuals who would provide value to a playoff team and will pay dearly in return. We could build a powerhouse.

Am I saying trade Ichiro? No (and the Japanese owners wouldn't authorize it anyway). But I think at this point you need to put the word out that you're willing to listen. Who knows what you could be offered. I bet you would have some offers you might not be able to refuse.

I feel bad for Mclaren. He's going to get canned. He just doesn't have the ability to light a fire under these guys. It's unfortunate but that's the reality of the profession.

Man.....I sure miss the days of Lou, Carlos Guillen, Bret Boone, John Olerud, Dan Wilson, Edgar Martinez, Jamie Moyer. How thrilling it used to be to go to the ballpark with an expectation that your team was going to win. Now, you just know they're going to lose so you don't even bother to watch. What a shame.

But hey, all the yardwork I've been able to get done has made me rather famous in my neighborhood. I've got the best grass on the street.

Posted by The Troll

7:45 PM, May 23, 2008

Actually Putzy, I agree with you, I have been trying to say those same things for sometime now. Perhaps someone will listen to you. Let's hope so.

Posted by dc

7:51 PM, May 23, 2008

Jamie Moyer is 4-3 on the season

Posted by putzy

7:52 PM, May 23, 2008

yea, Jorge Campillo went seven strong for the Braves the other night...who'd he used to play for ?

Posted by dc

7:55 PM, May 23, 2008

In 14 games/27 innings pitched, Campillo's got a .99 era with 5 BB and 24 SO.

Posted by dc

7:57 PM, May 23, 2008

Randy Winn's hitting .296

Posted by Ryan

7:57 PM, May 23, 2008

Seriously Geoff, what the hell is taking so long? Someone needs to lose their job and it should've happened weeks ago. How long is ownership going to allow this to continue? Why wait until the season is for all intents and purposes, over? Anyone with a modicum of intelligence can see where this is headed. The plug needs to be pulled and now.

Posted by dc

7:58 PM, May 23, 2008

Podsednik's hitting .293 playing LF for the Rockies

Posted by K-Swag

7:59 PM, May 23, 2008

If only the players showed as much emotion as Mclaren.I dont think Mclaren is that great a manager and I question some of his decisions but with this team I feel kind of bad for him.

The only player I see frusterated is Ichiro and no not just because of the arguing with that ridiculous Umpire.

Everybody else seems lifeless we dont have winners on our team.I play basketball and if my team is not winning then I am mad I am frusterated and I'm gonna play 100 times harder.

These guys dont care and if they do they dont show it.They are a lifeless team and they were last year when they lost 17-19 and choked themselves out of the playoffs.

Its time to get rid of these guys.Richie gone.Vidro gone.Jarrod gone.Batista gone.

Trade for some big name Hitters you already gave away the farm for Bedard now give whats left for some all-stars.Thats the only way we have a chance to make a run at the playoffs.

And the odds are those things wont happen so we will lose 100 games this year.

Posted by putzy

7:59 PM, May 23, 2008

Jorge Campillo , "El Caballo,"

Posted by dc

8:00 PM, May 23, 2008

Ryan Franklin's got a 1.57 era in 23 ip coming out of the bullpen for the Cardinals.

Posted by dc

8:05 PM, May 23, 2008

Clement's got 3 hr's, is hitting .300 and has 6 RBI since going back to Tacoma.

Posted by putzy

8:07 PM, May 23, 2008

Actually Putzy, I agree with you, I have been trying to say those same things for sometime now. Perhaps someone will listen to you. Let's hope so.

bless you my son...

Posted by thatgirl

8:07 PM, May 23, 2008

Geoff Ė Thank you for the video. It's great to see the rich baseball history at Yankee stadium. It helped to take my mind off the Mís woes.

P.S. I agree with you too Putzy.

Posted by First Man

8:07 PM, May 23, 2008

You see, all these ex-M's doing so well, there has got to be a curse.

Posted by dc

8:09 PM, May 23, 2008

Frank Thomas is hitting .309 in the month of May for the Athletics. He's got 3 HR's and 11 RBI.

Posted by BWare

8:10 PM, May 23, 2008

Geoff:

Here's an idle though...

Looks like the Mets' ownership is set to make Willie Randolph swim with the fishes. Think the M's are waiting for that to happen before they give Mac a burial at sea, then go dredge up Willie?

Just curious...

Posted by SKC

8:10 PM, May 23, 2008

Who do we hire as MGR when Mac is fired?

Adios,
You make reference to Griffey in a trade. He is 38 and wants to win a title, you think he is going to approve that trade now? I don't.

Posted by seattlein2009

8:11 PM, May 23, 2008


Watching a team with a lot of talent play aimlessly through almost 1/3 of a season is painful for the fans. The Mariners, from the very start of this season have exhibited a lack of a plan, strategy, tactics etc. I find it amazing that batters have gone up to the plate without having a coach or a manager TELL them how they should approach their at bats in given circumstances. This is manifest in their inability to drive in runners that are in scoring position and sustain good rallies. The fault for this has to lay at the feet of everyone involved in "administration".... from advanced-scouting (do the Mariners do much?) to manager to coaches etc. I even question the physical training programs that have had 5 of the pitchers show up with some form of injury already, ranging from Silva's back, JJ's chest etc. As far as Bavasi, I am not a fan, and he makes a lot of the decisions with respect to the managing, coaching staffs etc. so this is at his doorstep. Sherrill's recent comments, if you read between the lines, also talks of problems with clubhouse chemistry. It is quite clear that the Mariners need all new administrative personnel. The bullpen coach, the pitching coach, the bench and line coaches and the manager, as well as other team support staff, scouting etc should be cleaned out. Someone STRONG (like a Bobby Valentine-type) who has a deep and sophisticated view of how the game (and players) should be treated is needed to create a new staff. It is highly unlikely that even if these changes were made tomorrow the team will be playing meaningful games THIS September, but it would set the stage to prevent the horror show that we are seeing, being repeated next year. There is a vicious cycle that playing like this leads to poor attendance, which leads to budget issues, that leads to less talent, that leads to playing like this again. I would hate to see that happen in Seattle. There are also player decisions that should be made, as it is clear that Sexson has become a liability at 1B and is not longer carrying his anemic BA and unproductive at bats with HRs. In fact, he could have 20 HRs right now and I am not sure it would compensate for his fielding and rally-killing atbats. Other personnel need to be evaluated, but only in light of a certain unhealthy clubhouse situations that the manager/coaches etc. have allowed to take place (i.e. since when can a pitcher like Jared Washburn call out his catcher in public and then be rewarded for it??) The whole mess is sickening. I want to watch good baseball. Even if the team doesn't make the post-season I want the feeling that they have gone out and had every chance to win (scouting, coaching etc.) This is a poorly managed, poorly coached, poorly organized team putting out a terrible product. The Mariners are lucky this is Seattle, where the fans are a bit more "laid back"...In other cities the team would have a crowd sitting with bags over their heads, as that is really what this team deserves. If Lincoln doesn't move decisively and thoroughly, ownership should think about his slot also.

Posted by dc

8:12 PM, May 23, 2008

Hey Firstman.....

It's not a curse. It's an inability to evaluate and then successfully manage talent. Of course, I haven't posted Pineiro's numbers, nor Asdrubal Cabrera's, but the point is the same. It's a flip of a coin when this team decides on what players to bring on. They wouldn't take a flyer on Frank Thomas but I don't see the Athletics complaining about that one. They gave away the likes of Soriano/Franklin/Norton/Campillo......and then signed the likes of Carl Everett/Brad Wilkerson/Jose Vidro/Scott Spazeeeeoooo/etc.

Posted by putzy

8:13 PM, May 23, 2008

whomever they hire, he/she better smoke four packs per day and drink a fifth of jack a day...and spit and cuzz...and play cards and stuff

Posted by SKC

8:14 PM, May 23, 2008

BWare,

I was thinking of Willie this afternoon. Might be a good hire. He does have a little more fire in him.

Posted by manzell

8:16 PM, May 23, 2008

I think McLaren has proven himself to be a crappy, crappy manager. His lineups don't make any sense, and he's mismanaged the bullpen severely this year. His in-game strategy is based on fetishizing "fundamentals" at the expense of, you know, scoring runs.

Bavasi has shown that he is a decent GM - for a team from the 90's. There are too many GM's who are SABR-savvy, good talent evaluators, and good deal-makers that a relatively old-school guy like Bavasi needs to retool in order to compete with them. He's built a team of modest talent with at least several "achilles heel" players and facets. We have guys on our team that simply DONT contribute. Even the crappy 80's Mariners teams had guys that either played good defense or hit the ball well; we've got Cairo, Vidro, and Sexson who do neither.

I have no faith in McLaren to change. He needs to be fired. He might as well not bother showing up tomorrow to work as far as I'm concerned - there is NOTHING that McLaren can do to contribute to winning. We might as well install Ibanez as a player-coach.

Bavasi, at least, seems like a smart guy who isn't fundamentally stubborn, but is just using the tools he knows. If he's willing to change his strategy, he can stay; otherwise, I'd love to hire KIM NG as GM.

Posted by kranky

8:19 PM, May 23, 2008

I've proposed Dan Rohn, former Raniers manager who did nothing but win, win, win in Triple A, as new Ms manager.

I will repeat that now.

Posted by putzy

8:21 PM, May 23, 2008

if it was not for our scouting and drafting abilities we'd really be up the creek without a paddle..we dump all our talent for these overpriced bums...and they are laughing all the way to the bank... we're like the Yanks of the 80's and the Angels of the 70's and 80's the place where retreds go...the over the hill guys go to pick up one more fat check...

Posted by First Man

8:22 PM, May 23, 2008

seattlein2009 - Good Post! Clear thinking and direct to the problems.

Posted by kranky

8:24 PM, May 23, 2008

Actually, they need to dump Bavasi first. If Bavasi replaces McLaren now, then that guy is just going to get the boot this fall when Bavasi is escorted out of the building.

So save Dan Rohn for a permanent change this fall and let Perlozzo or some other hack pick up the end of this season on a temporary basis.

Posted by putzy

8:27 PM, May 23, 2008

Actually, they need to dump Bavasi first. If Bavasi replaces McLaren now, then that guy is just going to get the boot this fall when Bavasi is escorted out of the building.

So save Dan Rohn for a permanent change this fall and let Perlozzo or some other hack pick up the end of this season on a temporary basis.

I like it...

Posted by The Troll

8:28 PM, May 23, 2008

Hey Kranky - Wasn't it Grover who had Rohn fired? Rohn as I recalled had some ideas then but he was sacrificed on the Hargrove altar. Good idea.

Posted by Tom

8:30 PM, May 23, 2008

Geoff,

I know you can't suggest anyone getting fired on your blog since you aren't a columnist and aren't on talk radio. But I will say this. . .

The problems this organization has starts at the very top and it's taken me until now to realize this. It's not John McLaren, or even Bill Bavasi. This is about the man who approved every one of Bill Bavasi's moves during his time here and said earlier this one he was doing a "fantastic job" or something to that extent.

That would be of course, president of BASEBALL OPERATIONS: Chuck Armstrong.

What a joke. President of Baseball Operations.

If this team wants to turn itself around, instead of hiring a new GM and throwing money at this problem, this team needs to get a new president of baseball operations that is a BASEBALL GUY that will hire and fire people accordingly and bring a fresh new philosophy to this organziation.

Someone like a Terry Ryan or a Larry Beinfest would be perfect for that job.

Then he could sit down with every front office member and manager John McLaren and ask them for an honest answer as to why this team is in this sad state right now and what role each of them had in getting to this point just like Donnie Walsh of the New York Knicks did with Isiah Thomas a few weeks ago.

If this team ever wants to turn it around, that's where it needs to start, at the top and it starts with the intention first and foremost of building a World Series winner, not just making a profit at the gate.

And if Howard Lincoln doesn't have the guts to fire Chuck Armstrong because of this pathetic season and 7 straight playoff-less seasons, then he needs to just pack his bags and go home one way or another and someone more charismatic must be brought in like a Steve Balmer to fill Howie's position through the Mariners board of trustees.

There's no reason to think why this organization can't produce a winning club by '09 or 2010, but it's going to have to start RIGHT NOW with a huge about face all around from management, coaches, and players.

Posted by kranky

8:32 PM, May 23, 2008

I'm not sure if it was Grover, but somebody got nervous about having Rohn looking over their shoulder. So he was fired. But Rohn was a great guy on his way out, heaping praise on the Mariner organization. Obviously the guy was smart enough not to burn his bridges with the Ms.

I missed Sherrill's comments about clubhouse chemistry that seattlein2009 mentions. What did George say?

Posted by Jaytee

8:41 PM, May 23, 2008

The Mariners played better all around during those four games Sexson was suspended and couldn't even come to the park. Negative karma?

Posted by seattlein2009

8:42 PM, May 23, 2008

P.S. I DO think the Mariners' core of players has a lot of talent. Johjima needs to get untracked but he was a top 5 AL offensive catcher last year. IF there are issues with his pitch calling, then that is a coaching situation that can be addressed. Jose Lopez is a decent fielder who has a good bat for a 2B. Betancourt is excellent with the glove, has a solid bat, but needs a LOT of coaching with respect to how he hits in given situations. Beltre is a top talent at 3B, and a prototype #3 or #5 hitter. So 3 our of 4 infield spots are excellent IMHO. Ichiro is Ichiro and Ibanez is a clutch hitter, with a good arm, but not a great "ball scout" in LF. If he has the reflexes he should be moved to 1B and that rounds out C, 1, 2, SS, 3B with what could be considered top-shelf players with Ichiro in CF. That leaves 2 outfield slots open. Balentien has a great arm, but looked like a butcher in right field. In addition, for those 2 slots, the Mariners could definitely use hitters with good OBP and who don't lose a lot of atbats to strikeouts as they have enough "free swingers" already. Assuming Bedard is healthy, he and Felix have the capability of winning a post-season for this team if they can only get there. Arizona and Florida are two teams that have proven you can win a World Series with 2 aces and average-slightly above average teams if you get to the World Series. Silva seems to be a "pitcher"....Not sure if Washburn and Batista are toast as starters, but the M's have enough talent with Fieraband, Morrow, Roland-Smith to stretch out a few and try them, or pick up an agent again in the offseason. Bullpen needs some good coaching, but certainly has a good mix with Putz, Lowe, Green as a core. So, Christmas shopping list (using Richie's money) is to get 2 outfielders with some "bat control" and 1 or 2 starters (or home grow them.) This excludes Clement and Balentien right now. If Clement could play 1B and not strike out 120 times, then you might keep Ibanez in OF for one or two more years and
play Clement there. However, as far as players and talent go the Mariners are pretty close and have the wherewithall to field a competitive team that, in 2009, IF it were to get to post-season, could ride on the tails of a hot Bedard/Felix combo to glory. Obviously the other key was discussed in my other post. You need one STRONG sophisticated person who becomes the touchstone for the philosophy, strategy, tactics and support personnel to then create a team that has better chemistry and functions up to its skills. This is not an 18-34 team. In fact, even with the current "holes" like Richie, Washburn, Batista, it is probably more like a 29-23 team based on its raw talent. What a waste!!

Posted by Lance

8:44 PM, May 23, 2008

Other then to say that you can expect the San Diego Padres to make a big push to get Cha Seung Beck into their starting rotation, there's really nothing left for me to say that I haven't already said.

So, until John McLaren is no longer the manager of the Seattle Mariners, I will no longer be making any comments on to Geoff's blog. Not that that's any great loss, or anything.

And, It's not that I'm angry, or anything like that. I just don't care anymore.

Posted by Sounders

8:45 PM, May 23, 2008

I'm with ya Tom. I've been saying it for a while,changes are needed from the Top down. One aspect of their philosophy is trying to get players who don't get hurt, which is one of the only things they've been good at. Unfortunately 'hope our guys don't get hurt and their guys do' philosophy is not a winning one, nor does it instill a winning attitude.

Posted by The Troll

8:46 PM, May 23, 2008

It was four games ago in Detroit when Geoff said that loses like this get managers fired, but then there was a question if this comment was right. Afterwhich I responded that if the M's were swept in Detroit and New York then McLaren would be gone - well if he isn't gone by Memorial Day then there is clear dereliction of duty on Bavasi's part. Many express sympathy with Mac saying that he is not really at fault, but I cannot by that argument. Mac is a terrible field manager who is clueless when it comes to baseball strategy, tactics and leadership. Still if McLaren is a glorified bench coach, Bavasi is a glorified grounds keeper, and Armstrong is a glorified janitor. They all need to go - but at least, lets start with McLaren, he has plenty to account for despite his being a nice guy.

Posted by Lenny Randle's Breath

8:48 PM, May 23, 2008

Wow, that was a great little clip Geoff! You've mentioned how difficult it is to get the players to comment after games. I think it would be neat if you could convince a couple to do a little video blog.On their current state,etc. all.

These last 4 Mariner games have been very difficult to watch! These games have reminded me when I was a kid. It seemed like they would never win.

It's going to be interesting to see what happens when they get back from this road trip.

GO MARINERS!!!

Posted by seadog

8:49 PM, May 23, 2008

Intelligent comments have been demanded from the comments submitted to this blog, I can't say it any better than this quote from FoxSports made by Ichiro:

"Playing on this team and seeing what's happening around me, I feel that something is beginning to fall apart," Suzuki said through a translator. "But, if I was not in the situation and I was objectively watching what had happened to this team in the past week, I would probably be drinking a lot of beers and brewing it."

What kind of beer?

"Usually I enjoy Japanese beer, but given the situation, if I was objectively watching the game, I wouldn't care if it was Japanese beer, American beer or beer from Papua New Guinea," he said.

Posted by Reaper

9:06 PM, May 23, 2008

I am Nintendo....

I need to fire "Old Man Lincoln", Bill "Mr. Clean" Bavasi, and the entire coaching staff.

I need to hire Bobby 'Winner' Valentine and his entire coaching staff for the Mariners.

I need to subsidize the Chiba Lotte Marines for three years.

I need to make better games for the Wii.

Posted by atrain

9:09 PM, May 23, 2008

The two people I feel the worst for are Johnny Mac and Geoff. At least we get to turn away. They have to watch and attempt to explain the unexplainable. I'm not saying JM is perfect, but this team is so bad, they don't even give him a chance to screw up the games. You want to blame Bavasi for bad personnel decisions, I'm with you. But thinking that this team will snap out of its funk simply because Mac is gone is absurd. How many titles did Lou Pinella win in Tampa? A crappy team always trumps a good coach. Anyone who works in the real world knows that the boss can only do so much and ultimately the employees determine its success.

Posted by snorg troll

9:19 PM, May 23, 2008

It dusgusts me to her Howard Lincoln, Chuck Armstrong, Bill Bavasi, and company continually tell us year after year to be patient and that everything is going to work out in the end. Well, it hasn't worked out in the end, since what 2002? How long will we continue to have to hear this line of crap before the people in upper management (ex. Lincoln, Armstrong, Babasi, etc,) to be held accountable and be fired for producing this CRAP!!

My personal view is that the only reason these people are still around is because the Mariners are making money. If they were losing money we might not see these folks around, because all they seem to care about is taking home a profit on a day in and day out basis.

Well, this theory isn't going to work for long, because people are going to stop going to the ballpark and they'll start loding money. So, why don't the Mariners just save everybody/d time and start the firings of these people now so we can actually bring in people from top to bottom who actually want to win, and will actually start winning. How much longer do the fans of this franchise and the people of the Pacific Northwest have to put with the brand of crap that the Mariners are rolling out everyday before the Mariners start making changes? From, snorg troll.

Posted by DFA

9:25 PM, May 23, 2008

The 2008 Seattle Mariners: 3/31/2008 - 5/23/2008. Rest in Peace.....

Posted by whatever

9:33 PM, May 23, 2008

"This isn't fantasy baseball you know...."

An insult made by jerk who just happens to be a principal of the last place, worst record in the Al, and tied with SD for the worst record (18-31) in major league baseball.

Who is laughing now.

Posted by firemacnow

9:37 PM, May 23, 2008

At 5:30 I was planning on just flipping back and forth between the M's game and the Lakers/Spurs game, but Erik Bedard made it alot more easy on me!! I just kept it on the Lakers game and didn't even switch back. Ichiro, i'll take your advice i'm about to head down to Belltown in 20minutes and try to drown my sorrows over this Miserable season. Geoff...Did Bedard even have enough guts to talk to the media after the game?? I would of liked to know what catcher he needs now that will allow him not to get SHELLED, every game from here on out.

Posted by Little dog fido

9:39 PM, May 23, 2008

Thank god we traded away most of our minor league talent. Maybe the Mariners and Rainiers should switch places. Might be more entertaining to watch.

Posted by DistantFan

9:47 PM, May 23, 2008

My vow: No more money, time or attention spent on the Mariner's until they truly address the real problems of the organization. Have a good summer, y'all.

Posted by MLG

9:52 PM, May 23, 2008

Perhaps trading five players (four of whom were pitchers along with the best young bat in the organization) for one starting pitcher wasn't such a great move?

I'll be shocked if another team ever hires Bavasi as a GM once his reign of terror is over in Seattle.

Posted by Resin isn't Cheating

10:03 PM, May 23, 2008

The 4 1/3 innings by Erik Bedard tonight was actually the most by any Seattle starter on the road trip

Stop making excuses and sugar coating what Bedard did to the team today. Your Canadian boy has pitched 14.1 innings his last three starts. That's averaging 4.7 innings his last three starts, that sucks. Where is the accountability Geoff? He gave up 9 runs today and has a 6.35 ERA for the month of May.

I could easily do what Geoff did with his slam on Balentien by making the absurd suggestion that if you take away Bedard's first two starts of the year, he would be looking like a bust right now and won of the worst starters in the American League.

But I won't do that, but I sure as heck will call out a pitcher that has stunk for the month of May and gave up 9 runs today. Was Bedard available for an interview after the game?

Posted by Resin isn't Cheating

10:07 PM, May 23, 2008

Turns out, the bad inning came in the fifth. That's now two starts in the last three where Bedard let his team down. He's just as guilty as any of the other starting five when it comes to the rotation's collapse. At this point, though, analyzing individual games is almost pointless. This season has collapsed.

So your saying it's pointless to make Bedard accountable for his performance today and teh month of May. Sure I understand......but Felix being restrained is worse than your #1 opening day starter giving up 9 runs today.

Posted by Adam

10:13 PM, May 23, 2008

Listen, for all the talk of getting rid of McLaren (a must) and Bavasi (he's had enough time), the fact remains that this organization's philosophy and plan of attack will not change much until changes are made at the tippy-top.

Geoff made the point earlier today: Lincoln/Armstrong are making money for ownership, so getting rid of them isn't going to happen.


I think Lincoln/Armstrong believe the fan base would revolt if a rebuilding took place. They cringe at the thought of drawing less than 2 million at Safeco, so anything they can do to make money - they will do. Rebuilding usually causes attendance to fall - see Cleveland.

I've seen calls for Antonetti for GM; I've called for Bobby Valentine as a manager. But let's face it, neither man will likely come to a team that is run the way the Mariners are. Both are too bright for that. The writing is on the wall: Seattle's ownership will dictate the direction of the team.


If there is any hope for Mariners fans, one of three things must happen:

1. New ownership must arise (not going to happen)

2. Ownership replaces Lincoln/Armstrong (not going to happen)

3. Lincoln/Armstrong commit to a rebuilding and give the new GM free rein (not likely to happen)


So, basically, there is little to no hope for Mariner fans so long as upper management/ownership remains the same.

Posted by AD21

10:16 PM, May 23, 2008

I for one am defending Bill Bavasi. If ownership would've given him a $250M payroll, the Mariners would be playing .500 ball.

Posted by Adam

10:18 PM, May 23, 2008

As a follow-up:


I believe that if Lincoln/Armstrong hired a competent, independent GM (which they won't), they would still mandate the moves to be made to him (or her).


So a new GM isn't going to help too much, unless you think hording veterans, adding washed-up FAs, and ignoring young prospects is the way to go.

Posted by AD21

10:19 PM, May 23, 2008

There's nothing wrong with the current ownership. The man has given you $118M in resources to build a contender.

If they need to replace Lincoln, Armstrong and Bavasi, that's a different story but don't blame ownership when the payroll is in the top 10 of MLB.

Posted by Adam

10:21 PM, May 23, 2008

Ownership mandates Bavasi's moves. If they get rid of him, they'll bring in somebody else to do the same job.


And the team will still stink

Posted by JA Hippy

10:24 PM, May 23, 2008

I had not heard the score yet when I logged on a few minutes ago. As the page was coming up I predicted that Mac had been fired today. Given the 13-2 result maybe he would have been happier taking Ichiro's advice - sit in the stands, have a few beers and boo.

He is not new blood and probably not the light a fire personality they need but I was hoping to see Mabton Mel get the job.

Posted by Corey Miller

10:26 PM, May 23, 2008

Hmmm....Resin, the comment Geoff made about Badard was ripe with sarcasm and a "Guess what?" underbelly.

"The 4 1/3 innings by Erik Bedard tonight was actually the most by any Seattle starter on the road trip"

He wasn't praising him. He was simply saying WOW thats the most any pitcher has pitched...and it was only 4 1/3 innings.

Posted by Sklyansky

10:28 PM, May 23, 2008

Lincoln basically ran Piniella out-of-town because he wanted to make it clear this was his (Lincoln's) team, so I highly doubt that as long as he's around that we'll see Bobby Valentine managing the M's.

We'll likely see some Hargrove-esque retread who is just happy to have a job, and won't make any waves whatsoever. Lincoln's getting up there in years, maybe he'll mercifully retire, and the M's can actually adopt a different philosophy.

I feel bad for Geoff. I wouldn't want to cover this team, even if I was paid and got a travel stipend.

Posted by TimeHasComeToday

10:30 PM, May 23, 2008

If I was a defense attorney, the only defense you could use for the starting pitching would be:

Members of the jury, the aforementioned Seattle five and their associates the bullpen seven have continually been criticized by their inconsistent play on the mound. They have logged 32 innings and given up 40+ runs in the last four games. There is no mistaking that the quality of play is horrendous. As a result the malevolent fan base of the Mariners, they have consistently harrassed the defendents, causing them to remain silent following this troubled stretch. But, I would argue that the defendents have been treated somewhat unfairly.

The anemic offense has continually induced our illustrious 12 to pitch too fine. They are forced to pitch shutouts which are beyond their means. They have also faced two ball clubs that have struggled in the early going. Their opponents tenacity and passion for winning, have begun to show and at the expense of the 12 have made them look like t-ball pitchers.

So do not place sole responsibility on the 12 defendents, but also on an offense with little patience, free swingers, consistenly oblivious of situational hitting and without passion for the game to carry their burden.

You may also look to Beaver Cleaver, their manager, who attempts to discipline his team, but continually appeases them. Or curly, our GM who has constructed an offensive ball club with no concept of team, aging ball players past their prime and young players with no direction.

Members of the jury, I trust your judgement and that you show mercy to the 12. Thank you.


Otherwise, there is absolutely no excuse.

Posted by macdoubter

10:37 PM, May 23, 2008

Seriously, most of us are amazed at this team's "performance" because they shouldn't be this bad. I think this team doesn't care and it has given up. It must have a lot to do with the manager, for whatever reason. Doesn't anyone else get that feeling?

Posted by Dave from the Coast

10:38 PM, May 23, 2008

I'm beginning to believe that the M's ARE 'hexed'. Yep, it ain't fantasy baseball, it's the real thing, and it's getting pretty painful to watch. I'm almost rooting for the M's to LOSE games now...see if they can post a record games-lost mark for a single season. Of course, if I root for the M's to lose, they might start winning. Seriously, the M's have needed Pitching for A Long Time now. It's gotta be hard to go out there day after day and play catch-up baseball. There seems also, to be a prevailing logic that says, "we're paying so much to play these guys that they're gonna keep playing"...so hence Sexson, for instance, keeps getting inserted into the lineup day after painful day. I think sending Baek back down to the minors was a "Baek-ward" decision, too. I've seen more long-relief these last few Mariners games than I usually see IN A SEASON. I don't fault Mac at all; he pretty much inherited the job from a Coach Who Quit. I think the deflation process really began when Mike Hargrove quit...that couldn't have improved team morale very much. Honestly, this season has been awful so far. Why not play Bloomquist full-time? Not that he's the answer, but he can do things; he plays most every positiion well. If he was playing with some regularity, I'm sure his batting average would improve. But it all comes back to the PITCHING. And none of the M's pitchers "have it"...even when Felix takes the mound, I'm not Sure the M's Are Going To Win. Good Pitching keeps a team in the game. When a team falls behind by a half-dozen runs before the game is even HALFWAY over, the morale sinks deeper, and Good Things Don't happen. I'm not calling for anyone's head on a platter, but let's substitute more freely...bring up fresh players from the minors and just see what happens. Something's gotta be done. Only, I don't know if anything can be done at this point. I like baseball so much, I don't care if the M's ever go to a series, but they can't even COMPETE right now. Wasn't the back-to-back wins last week the FIRST time the M's have done that this year? I thot I heard one of the radio sportscasters say so. I'll continue to watch...even if my doing so this season amounts to no more than sports-oriented masochism.

Posted by macdoubter

10:51 PM, May 23, 2008

You people, the ones who write that you "feel sorry for Geoff for having to watch and cover the Mariners" ... are you serious??!?!?!?!?!! IT'S HIS JOB. HE GETS PAID TO WATCH THIS HORRIBLE TEAM AND WRITE ABOUT IT AND THEN SPIN IT ON A BLOG. Jeeeez!!!.

Posted by AD21

10:56 PM, May 23, 2008

Ownership mandates Bavasi's moves. If they get rid of him, they'll bring in somebody else to do the same job. - Adam

Maybe if a GM is able to spend the money wisely, the team wouldn't stink?

Posted by vandelay87

11:05 PM, May 23, 2008

Alright! Again, we're tied for worst record in MLB with those Padres. At least Kevin Towers is facing their failure head on with the media. The Padres are #19 in MLB payroll at $74M.

M's are #9 and are spending $118M!

BTW, the Marlins are LAST in payroll at $22M and are in 1st place (27-20) in the NL East. Can we steal their GM?

Posted by Nat

11:09 PM, May 23, 2008

TimeHasComeToday- thanks for the laugh, I needed that! I can't bring myself to post much anymore because it's all been said.

I agree with the commenter though who said if you think of the Mariners like a soap opera then it can be almost funny. Almost.

Posted by Walla Walla Girl

11:22 PM, May 23, 2008

Adam, I believe you are correct. And to those who say we need a strong manager, I say a strong manager will not accept this job since it is apparently run from above (ownership, Armstrong/Lincoln, Bavasi). As I understand it, that is why Lou left.

Yep, there is not much hope for M's fans until changes are made at the top.

Ichiro's right too. Have a beer, y'all.

Posted by ethan

11:26 PM, May 23, 2008

i was watching the Celtics/Pistons game(??) on TBS the other night...and they had an advertisment for a Mariners-Yankees game on Sunday. lolol are you serious?? i laughed out loud and had a deep sense of embarrassment. then i thought.."we'll there's lots of Yankees fans on the planet..TBS will treat them to a 10-2 win."

Posted by Brian

11:43 PM, May 23, 2008

Since things are already so bad in the Mariners clubhouse they might as well talk to Barry Bonds. It's not like he'll ruin any chemistry in there. I knew before the season started the Mariners would be bad. You need more than starting pitching. You need some power in your lineup. The Mariners are just like the Blue Jays, a bunch of singles hitters.

Posted by scottM

12:03 AM, May 24, 2008

"Hey Kranky - Wasn't it Grover who had Rohn fired? Rohn as I recalled had some ideas then but he was sacrificed on the Hargrove altar."

Yeah, in 2006 when Hargrove was on shakey ground, Rohn was fired, seemingly out of the blue. It was easy to infer from the abruptness of how he was canned, that he was maneuvering to be Hargrove's replacement. Seemingly, the politicking backfired and Rohn got the boot.

Posted by scottM

12:08 AM, May 24, 2008

C'mon, think about it. Bringing Barry Bond on this team might have made sense from a pure hitting standpoint IF the M's were contending in '08. Last I looked we were sinking fast and faster. It makes NO sense if we're looking to 2009. Mr. Bond has about 14 counts of perjury he's facing in the next off-season, so what would be the point of securing him now? Grooming Clement for the Bigs at DH makes far more sense.

Posted by Chris from Bothell

1:11 AM, May 24, 2008

When even Ichiro is saying it's over... yeah. It's over.

Posted by Naked Ichiro

4:44 AM, May 24, 2008

www.myblog.110mb.com

Ichiro's blog

Posted by ricofoy

6:05 AM, May 24, 2008

I said over 2 weeks ago...the ship be sunk. Nice to see everyone coming around. Fire Mclaren? Of course. Anyone who hitches his wagon to a washed-up Dick Sexson deserves to be canned. Hey Mac,how's that loyalty to the vets working out for you?
On the other hand, anyone with half a brain knows you could bring John McGraw back from the dead to manage this team and it wouldn't make a damn bit of difference. Not as long as the 3 Stooges are at the helm. Although this team is so dead and so lifeless a bag of bones as a manager would be appropriate.
Howie Eagle Scout Lincoln..take a bow. And fire your own ass like you said you would a couple years ago. Doesn't a good boy scout keep his promises?
Chuck Howdy Doody Armstrong..a relic from the Argyros era. Think about that. There's your curse right there. How the hell this fool is in baseball period, never mind president of a MLB club, is beyond all sense and reason.
Bill IDIOT Bavasi...I don't even know where to begin but let's just say it will take years for a competent GM to dig out of the hole he's put the team in.
30 million a year for your 3,4,5 starters and they all SUCK! What a joke.

Posted by Elliott

6:22 AM, May 24, 2008

Send the whole team down to AAA, coaches and all. Bring up the Rainiers and let's see if THEY have any spark.

Posted by ricofoy

7:04 AM, May 24, 2008

Bedard certainly seems like a chill kind of dude. Does he ever get angry or upset about anything? It seems like everything is "whatever, what can you do, sometimes you got it, sometimes you don't". Don't get me wrong, that's a good attitude to have in life but for a pro athlete I'm not so sure.

Posted by helpFelix

7:20 AM, May 24, 2008

Remember when the Mariner Brass needed a scapegoat when Bob Melvin was here? So they fired him, and our BEST pitching coach EVER went over to the DBacks along with Melvin...

What's happened with the DBacks since Bob Melvin? Wow...they've won a World Series...AND I PICKED them this offseason to win it this year!

Bottom Line?

We can keep sending GMs and managers on their way, and blame all of them...BUT THIS TIME...Howard Lincoln & Chuck Armstrong BOTH are on the hot seat now too. THEY ALL NEED TO GO!!!

Amazing how you can have a $117M payroll team WITH NO CEMISTRY! Detroit is experiencing the same thing...but hey at least the Tigers dominated the M's and swept them!

Posted by jro

7:31 AM, May 24, 2008

It seems most people have come around to the "something must be done" side of the fence. Now, the conversation seems to be around which "surgical" cuts make the most sense -- fire Mclaren, Bavasi at seasons end, trade veterans now, etc.

Honestly, there are so many core changes that need to be made that I doubt it matters which order they occur. We're not in a one-or-two-players away situation.

We don't have to be rash, but we have a LOT of moves to make in the future if this organization expects to change the direction.

Posted by dc

7:32 AM, May 24, 2008

Good morning Helpfelix....

Just a small correction.....the Diamondbacks only World Series victory was in 2001, long before Melvin ever went there. I think maybe you meant they went to the playoffs under Melvin?

Posted by jumping ship

7:41 AM, May 24, 2008

As a transplanted M's fan, I can't tell you all how embarassing it is to watch the scores scroll accross the screen at the local watering hole and have to try to explain why I even bother with this team. This season is by far the most dissapointing and embarassing in my lifetime.

The worst part is that Bedard is going to jump ship after next season, and we won't have anything to show for another bonehead trade.

At this point, Ichiro is like Griffey of the early 90's: he's the only thing making me even remotely consider heading out to the Safe when I'm in town. Other than him, this team is full of barely competent AAA players.

Posted by Tool - Man

7:54 AM, May 24, 2008

Tim Lincecum is 6-1 with a 2.10 ERA for the Giants who are a terrible team.

This is truly a testament that Bavasi has no idea how to evaluate talent.

He is killing this team.

Posted by Jeff C

8:35 AM, May 24, 2008

Geoff, you say the M's on paper aren't really this bad? Isn't that what the Arizona Cardinals have been saying for about a decade?

Posted by Faceplant

8:42 AM, May 24, 2008

"It was easy to infer from the abruptness of how he was canned, that he was maneuvering to be Hargrove's replacement. Seemingly, the politicking backfired and Rohn got the boot."

No, Rohn was slamming Hargrove to teammates. I don't care if you play baseball, or work at McDonalds if you insult your boss to your coworkers and your boss finds out you are probably going to get fired.

Posted by macdoubter

9:00 AM, May 24, 2008

Screw Bedard, I don't care if he does leave after next season. His attitude is awful and he's come off as a real jerk ever since his first press conference with the Ms. I doubt his positive outlook is doing anything to help right now.

And franky, I'm just not that impressed with his pitching thus far. I don't care what he did before coming to Seattle, he doesn't look all that great.

Posted by myron

9:01 AM, May 24, 2008

Hey Geoff,

Friday afternoon I was listening to Sportsnation on ESPN radio and one of the host, who's name slips my mind, mentions that rumors were flying around that there are players in the Mariner locker room who are really growing tired of McClaren as the manager. Have you heard what, if any, rumblings going on that could really be the root of all the struggles this year going on with the team? Sportsnation was saying that some of the players can't wait till he is fired and if this is the case, then as a Mariner's fan I can pretty much give up on this year because this is the kind of bad negativity that has pretty much ruled out any hope of salvaging a season.

Posted by byebyeSexson

9:09 AM, May 24, 2008

Hey, it's not as much fun as winning but we can still watch Richie! He gets a hit about once every five at bats!

byebye

Posted by macdoubter

9:11 AM, May 24, 2008

Myron, Geoff wouldn't know (he's too busy making silly videos or preparing his latest post slamming the blog posters or brainstorming comparisons of this team to the many blue jays teams of his day) OR admit such a thing.

But I hear ya. I called it earlier.
Like I suggested, doesn't it seem that for a team to play this poorly a big reason is because they've given up or don't care and they just don't want to perform for their manager?

Posted by scottM

9:11 AM, May 24, 2008

Faceplant: "No, Rohn was slamming Hargrove to teammates."

But why was he slamming Hargrove? At the time, Rohn's name was being mentioned often with the struggling '06 squad as a good replacement for Hargrove? Did he think that badmouthing the skipper would help his cause? In any even, you're right, he obviously deserved to be canned. The bigger question though: Does someone with this lack of sense in the clubhouse as an assistant coach make for a good manager, where the politics are far tougher?

Posted by DMK-Vancouver

9:14 AM, May 24, 2008

Geoff,

Do you think the problems began when Jose Guillen wasn't re-signed? I was one of those people who questioned his being acquired the year before, but he demonstrated his leadership and displayed a fire that wasn't in evidence before, or since. Do you think one of the major problems with this team is a lack of fiery, temperamental players who would kick b-tt if a teammate deserved it?

I keep thinking that this team's management style plays right into all the stereotypes regarding fielding a competitive team---veterans, chemistry, camaraderie. But without a catalyst, even the best fire won't get started, and when I look at this team's lineup, it doesn't take much imagination to realize that there isn't much here to worry about. But management looks at the bottom line and sees nothing to worry about because of fiscal soundness, not gamewise soundness.

Someone referred to "The Natural" as an example where huckster therapy is used to address the team's maladies. What was needed instead was heart and conviction and none of that is in evidence...sadly, too, because the shortcomings are not that hard to see...only pride and arrogance would allow someone to think otherwise.

Management deserves everything that is happening. As for the players, if they do not see what's wrong within their ranks, then they deserve the same fate.

Posted by Seth Cotner

9:16 AM, May 24, 2008

Maybe we can trade Willie Randolph for McLaren?

Geoff, seriously at least you have endless fodder to write about. How boring would it be if our team was just 'average'.

Btw... Griffey wants to win a world series... there is no way he would ever accept a trade to the M's at this point.

Posted by Faceplant

9:26 AM, May 24, 2008

"Did he think that badmouthing the skipper would help his cause?"


If he did, then he's the dumbest person alive. If you want a promotion do you think it's a good idea to badmouth your boss?

I was never that impressed with Rohn to be honest. Anyone who has their cleanup hitter bunt in the 3rd inning of a scoreless game doesn't deserve to be managing.

Posted by macdoubter

9:50 AM, May 24, 2008

Wow! did any of you just hear Bavasi's comments on the radio pregrame show? Here's a few things he said....

Re whether Mac should take any responsibility for the team's status: "this has NOTHING to do with the field manager, it is a roster issue, a player performance issue."

Re the status of the team: "it's baffling"..."this team's not out of it, it's by no means too late in the season"..."we may have been a little impatient when we brought up Wlad and Balentien".

Re making a move: "it would be hard to go out and find a player with better ability than our current players"..."before we take on another player, we need to make sure he is better than the players we have"...

Re current players: "we know we have a group of guys playing hard and doing their best"..."when they get to the plate they just get a little scattered"

When closing the interview, he said he was thankful for the opportunity to again repeat that this " has nothing to do with the field manager, it is a player and roster problem".

Oh I HATE HATE HATE this guy! What a dense idiot we have running the show!

Posted by Adam

10:00 AM, May 24, 2008

I don't even care anymore. I hope this team finishes with the worst record in baseball, by a lot, and ownership is forced to make changes.


2008 is going to SUCK.

I hope my son's baseball team is better.

Posted by Faceplant

10:12 AM, May 24, 2008

"Re whether Mac should take any responsibility for the team's status: "this has NOTHING to do with the field manager, it is a roster issue, a player performance issue."

To be honest Bavasi is right. Mac can't manage the team out of a 13-2 hole. Although I do think McLaren is a terrible manager, the reality is that most managers don't have that much of an impact on the way the team plays.


"Re making a move: "it would be hard to go out and find a player with better ability than our current players"..."before we take on another player, we need to make sure he is better than the players we have"..."

Uh, Bill... Jeff Clement is a better hitter than 2/3 of the current lineup. And it isn't necessarily the players, so much as how you untilize the talent you have.

Posted by myron

10:16 AM, May 24, 2008

My god, if there's anything that is a bright spot this miserable season is that there is no longer a shadow of a doubt where to look in terms of blame for our truly terrible GM, Bill Bavasi, who has no more excuses left to make. There is no transparent team improvement that he can hide behind, where instead of capitalizing on team progress as they were rebuilding, he instead tries to trick all of us M's fans into basking in the glory and cashing in with satisfaction of our newly attained mediocrity rather than strive to become better than that. I mean, Bavasi couldn't wait to let the entire Mariner nation about the impact he made with the Erik Bedard deal, but come on, every squirrel finds a nut once in a while. See, for every Bedard deal there have been a garbage pile of crappy deals that have set this team back, that if you take those deals away, who knows what kind of team we could of had. But I'm not stressing so much on the what if, I just want to show you the list and make you think....

-Richie Sexson 4 years, $50 million
-Got Edguado Perez from the Indians in a trade for Astrubal Cabrera(a jewel in our farm system we could have used in a better trade)
-Traded Rafael Soriano to the Braves for Horacio Ramirez
-Jarrod Washburn 4 years, $37 million
-Kenji Johjima 3 years, $24 million(when half of the pitching staff including Bedard and Washburn don't like the way he calls the games)
-Traded Carlos Guillen to the Tigers for John Halama???
-Fired Bob Melvin as manager who went on become manager of the year for the Diamondbacks
-Passed Tim Lincecum in the 06' MLB Draft(homestate boy, BTW. I mean if you like selling more tickets I guess
-Trading Jamie Moyer to the Phillies(who's veteran presence would be valuable to a young pitching staff)

I could go on but I'm feeling pretty depressed right now....

Posted by Beer and Booing

10:19 AM, May 24, 2008

I vote for more honesty (Ichiro), less BS (Bavasi).

Posted by michstandard

10:26 AM, May 24, 2008

Someone tell me this is some kind of mistake.
Sexson in right field? Why?
do we need him in the lineup that bad?
I always thought when you hit the bottom the only way you can go is "up". But as far as the 2008 M's are concerned, they keep digging and digging a huge hole after they reached the rock bottom. And, it looks like now they decided to bury themselves in it.
I hope they are now too embarrassed to come out of the hole.

Posted by John

10:34 AM, May 24, 2008

Over-under on the Yankees with 5 runs or more:
I say three innings.
Final score today: 8-1 Yankees.

Meanwhile Bavasi will blame it on the players (players he brought in by the way). What Bavasi doesn't realize is that these guys ARE playing to their abilities. They just suck.
Why can't Bavasi get that through his head?

Posted by Beer and Booing

10:36 AM, May 24, 2008

Sexson in RF is for defensive purposes only.

OWCH! Almost pushed my tongue clear through my cheek.

Posted by Bum Knee McGee

10:41 AM, May 24, 2008

Re making a move: "it would be hard to go out and find a player with better ability than our current players"..."before we take on another player, we need to make sure he is better than the players we have"...

If that is true then I feel sorry for the current state of MLB.

Posted by Beer and Booing

10:41 AM, May 24, 2008

Bavasi's response to "hitting rock bottom" is to get out the picks and jack hammers and keep digging!!

Posted by Beer and Booing

11:02 AM, May 24, 2008

The parallels between the collapse of the Sonics and the current state of affairs with the Ms are striking. Arrogant over-confident ownership management (Lincoln/Armstrong (M), Schultz/Walker (S)), that drove off high quality big personality WINNING coaches/managers/GMs (Lou and Gillick (M), Karl and MacMillan(S)),and replaced them with toady yes-men (MacLaren, Bavasi (M), Westphal, Sund, Weiss, et. al. (S)).

I knew we were in trouble when Lincoln and Armstrong were dismantling the good teams of early this decade and explained how their brilliant philosophy would guarantee winning baseball well into the future. That somehow they were the reason we had some good years. Wally Walker did the same thing with George Karl, let him go in spite of averaging 60 wins a year for 5 years. Westphal could not make the playoffs the next year with the same team!

The Sonics never recovered and are life and death to remain here. At least Armstrong doesnít have to build a new ballpark, he already fleeced the populace.

Posted by Quinault

11:41 AM, May 24, 2008

I expect changes around the All Star Break. That will be when McL will have completed his shake down year and will be about 15% under .500. Sinking fast enough to have the hot seats called into play. I expect Riggleman to be at the reigns until season end.

I am Native American and all my prayers / ceremonies have not helped this season. The folly of the front office is beyond me and all of you out there that still say that this is your team.

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