Senator Oemig is a cankor sore to the political process!!! He had no influence last year when he pulled this nutso stunt in the State Senate and this year will likly prove the same. Call it quits Oemig!

The Democratic leadership should reign in Senator Oemig before he becomes fodder for the Republicans to use in the upcoming election (on the other hand, go right ahead and show exactly what's wrong with the current situation in Olympia).

Really, no legislator should be spending time on anything not specifically related to the immediate welfare and safety of Washingtonians during this "short-session". Attempting to have the POTUS impeached (he leaves office in just over a year anyway) is simply a waste of time and effort in which the senator could actually be effective for his district.

Very good idea!

(still hard for people to read the Captcha thing - too dark)

Well...there's a lot of folks who sincerely believe they are neglecting their constitutional duty by NOT pursuing the Impeachment of Bush and Cheney. But this principle OVER politics gets lost in the partisan nature of modern politics, and the practical reality that the nighmare is almost over anyway...

Oemig is both a puke and my State Senator. He lied Toby Nixon out of the seat he connived 45th District Voters into electing him to. His promise to be a bi-partisan centrist problem solver who focused on education, transportation, and health care went out the window even before his first-day-on-the-legislative-job cab pulled away from the Capitol curb.

He's also unethical in his legislative behavior as evidenced by his use of his office and State resources to improperly intervene in a private labor dispute in order to influence the outcome in favor of the SEIU.

I filed a complaint with the legislature's ethics office to that end, and I'm awaiting a disposition of it.

Eric Oemig is a bag packing hey-boy of the netroots/DailyKus/MoveOn ultra-left wing of the Democratic Party, a POV that doesn't reflect the values of 45th District voters.

While the rest of Olympia on both sides of the aisle struggles to address desparately needed transportation issues - 520 is just a couple, three miles south of his district - Oemig acts like the drunk guy at a party who wears a lampshade and tries to kiss all the girls...and who never gets invited back!

Even his "friends" won't want him around again.

Eric Oemig: why friends don't let friends vote for Democrats!

The Piper

PS: Will and I don't agree on much, but he's dead on in re the most of the time illegible Captcha.

Will, he does stand out as a fringe leftist so inculcated with BDS that he'll waste 1000's of dollars for this garbage, while neglecting the business of representing his district so that he can be the Kos/Soros hero of the day.

Clearly, as a legislator, this clown is a waste of skin. But what are you going to do? He'll be cheered on by his fellow nutbags; he'll get another round of publicity, and hopefully, he'll be voted out or recalled to become the footnote on the pimple of the buttocks of the left that he has successfully strived (striven? Heh.) so hard to become.

Thank you Senator Oemig for finishing the important work of calling the Executive into account. Elections don't end abuse of power by the Office of the Executive, only impeachment can do that.

Failing to impeach allows the next president to assume the dangerously expanded powers arrogated to the Executive Office by George Bush and Dick Cheney. Failure to impeach means the next President Clinton, Romney, Obama or Huckabee can continue to lie us into war, spy on American citizens, kidnap and torture people across the world, and destroy the economy for us and future generations.
Failure to impeach allows Bush and Cheney to run amok and continue to jeopardize the security of this nation. The recent charade in the Gulf of Hormuz is proof that Bush intends to provoke war with Iran at all costs.
The US Constitution requires protection now. Every American gains when the rule of law applies to all of us equally. That includes the President and the Vice President. Our standing in the world suffers, and diplomacy is made impossible when international treaties are violated with impunity.

We have plenty of time to impeach. It could happen in an afternoon. Congress proved last session that no bill of import will be passed until Bush and Cheney are impeached. If restoring the US Constitution is the only thing congress achieves this session, it would be enough.

It is appropriate for a state legislature to send a memorial to Congress asking them to take action. I'm thankful that many of our state legislators are strong enough to stand up for our laws and our rights. They have sworn an oath of office to protect the constitution. The state legislature is not a campaign committee, they have the duty to represent us and to defend the rule of law.

Impeachment is imperative. Let's start the hearings in the House Judiciary Committee immediately and let the investigations of serious allegations begin. Americans deserve to know the truth, our country will be better for it.
I'm only voting for candidates who have the courage to use impeachment to restore the rule of law.

The impeachment must proceed. Thank you, Sen. Oemig! And thank you, D. Postman, for writing about the issue.

Years from now, people will look back with amazement at the reluctance of many Americans to hold Bush & Cheney accountable. They've killed hundreds of thousands of civilians and nearly 4000 US soldiers in an unjustified, mismanaged war. They've lied, tortured, corrupted our federal agencies, bankrupted the country, held prisoners in concentrations camps without trial, sent prisoners overseas to be tortured, suppressed evidence, outed a CIA agent, wiretapped illegally, misled the nation about the reasons for attacking Iraq and Iran, stolen elections, ..... The list goes on and on.

Not only is holding them accountable the right thing to do from a constitutional and moral perspective, it's also the expedient thing to do from a political point of view. No wonder Congress has an even lower approval rating than the president: they're letting him get away with impeachable crimes.

Finally, pursuing impeachment may be the only way to prevent Bush & Cheney from attacking Iran.

Those Democrat WIMPS are too cowardly to do anything to protect our Constitution and Laws. Our Constitution calls for their Impeachment based on already known facts without looking any further. Why do they not respect and follow our Constitution?
WIMPS is a very kind word!!!!!!!!!!
Lee

I am very puzzled by the negative comments directed against Senator Oemig. People seem very interested in outdoing each other with wisecracks. But none of these comments address the issue of whether Bush committed impeachable offenses. I would like to know if these people think Bush lied us into the Iraq war or not. There is strong evidence Bush committed serious crimes, and little by rhetorical gibberish to suggest otherwise. So I think it is appropriate for Congress to investigate these crimes and to impeach Bush if these is sufficient evidence. That is all that Senator Oemig is asking for. He deserves credit for defending the Constitution and American Democracy when others prefer to do nothing.

Thank you, Senator Oemig for standing up for the people of Washington State. Most taxpayers do not realize the cost of the Bush Administration. We need them impeached and removed from office before they start another disastrous war with Iran, which I fear we will not recover as a country.

This war that the Bush Administration has waged on Iraq is costing us millions per day - money that could be spent here at home. Our economy is going down the tubes as the value of the dollar falls at extraordinary rates. We do not have the resources or the heart for a war with Iran just so the Bush Administration and his buddies can make MORE trillions off the oil in the Middle East, which should belong to the citizens of those countries - NOT Shell, Texaco and Chevron.

So, thank you and bless you - don't listen to the idiotic comments stating that this is a waste of the taxpayer's time. I say it's a lot cheaper than a war with Iran.

Friends and neighbors, let’s drop the labeling and name-calling, the rancid partisanship, and the invective. Let’s look at this situation as fellow citizens, all and equally concerned about our country and flag.

Is the “war on terror” exactly as advertised? Did it begin on September 11, 2001, as the Bush Administration has told us? If we dig into the history and facts of this war, we learn otherwise. We find the commitment to invade Iraq was made in the first meeting of the President’s Security Council, on January 30, 2001, seven months before 9/11. We learn of a memo to the Security Council dated February 3, 2001 directing its staff to cooperate with the Energy Task Force in “…actions regarding the capture of new and existing oil and gas fields” in Iraq. We find the Bush Administration was negotiating pipelines—unsuccessfully—with the Taliban until August of 2001. Then President Bush notified Pakistan and India he would attack Afghanistan “…before the end of October.” Both wars were well underway before the attacks on the Trade Towers and the Pentagon.

So we don’t know the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth about these wars. I presume friends and neighbors, citizens first and partisans second, are anxious to know the truth. If we have been misled, we need to know that, and if we have not been misled we will know that, too: it all depends on finding the truth, the proven facts.

That is what impeachment and only impeachment can do. The inquiry into the alleged impeachable offenses turns up the truth, in documents and sworn testimony.

Senator Oemig sees sufficient evidence of wrongdoing to advocate impeachment, and he is not alone. 8016 has a number of co-sponsors, respected and honored Senators all.

This is not a partisan issue. This should concern every responsible and patriotic American of every political stripe. Mr. Bush and Mr. Cheney cannot be legally charged—or fully exonerated—without a serious inquiry into their conduct.

The lives of 3,000 young Americans, hundeds of thousands of Afghanis and Iraqis, and a half a trillion of our tax dollars have been poured into these wars. We need to know if it has been a worthy and honorable undertaking.

actually, if you ask chuck hagel, impeachment is a bipartisan issue. and to clarify postman's claims, some of the ivory tower dems mat have dismissed oemig's efforts last time around. but the state, a couple county, and more district orgs than you can shake a stick at all endorsed oemig's efforts and the impeachment movement. sadly, those who would dismiss this as a 'federal issue' ignore the blood and treasure that the people of washington state have squandered on account of bush's impeachable and illegal actions in leading our nation to war.

Personal attacks are not opinion. They are abuse.
That being said, it's hard to be optomistic about America when so many of our fellow Americans, even journalists, don't understand what impeachment really is and why it is important.

It is only real check on tryranny and criminality in that citizens have. If we don't exercise this power, then we lose everything. The government is no longer accountable to us.

Impeachment is not a political decision, it's a constitutional imperative in the face of gross abuse of power and criminal behavior.
An election, without impeachment simply institutionalizes the crimes and abuse, passing them on unabridged to the next president.

Impeachment is not a decision to be made by self serving political strategists whose salaries are paid by those that benefit from an imperial presidency and the graft and corruption that has riddled the Bush administration. It's our decision and we have given our consent.

It's insulting to our intelligence and our humanity to ask us to look away when more than a million people have been murdered for no legitimate reason. It wrong to ask us to be silent when our treasury has been looted and our civil liberties restricted. Only those who profit from death and tyranny would ask it.

We shouldn't be asking why Senator Oemig is filing a request for impeachment now, we should be asking why aren't more of our legislators, local and national, doing so. Their silence is shielding criminals. It is giving consent to some of worst abuses of power in US history.

Impeach and convict Bush!
Impeach and convict Cheney!

If their crimes don't require it, what crimes do?!

Today, our country has two Washingtons: the one in the District of Columbia that's being run by korporately driven kleptocrats; and the one that houses a city called Seattle. I've just found it easy to pledge allegiance to the latter jurisdiction were its state legislature to accept Sen. Oemig's noble, patriotic move to have Bush-Cheney impeached before they can further subvert our constitution.

http://www.bushbusiness.com/Bryant_OP.htm

http://www.petitiononline.com/arrest/petition.html

It is never too late to stand up for the Constitution, the rule of law, and the civil liberties of all Americans. The Bush administration has lied to take our country to war, has lied to keep us there, has chipped away at our civil liberties, illegally spied on us, has outed a CIA agent, has corrupted the DOJ, is committing war crimes, and trying to provoke another war. If ever there was an example of an administration fitting of impeachment is is the Bush/Cheney regime.

Impeachment isn't something that law makers can choose to use or not use, it is a mandate when the President/Vice President are suspected to have committed a crime, and in this case there is already ample evidence of crimes in the public record. Impeachment is about preserving our nation of laws where nobody is above the law. For those that think impeachment is not needed, are you comfortable with the next President having access to these newly created executive powers?

Oh yeah, and it shouldn't stop with Bush/Cheney, it should include Ried and Pelosi for obstructing the process, and it should include any high office holder of the Bush/Cheney regime.

The other politicians in Congress have time to hold soap opera style hearings for baseball players though! Time for Roger Clemens, but no time to prosecute Bush and Cheney for their lies, corruption and abuses to our constitution. Our 'democracy' has become a joke!

No impeachment? Probably best to leave them on the US payroll by retiring them in Leavenworth, Kansas instead of Parguay or Dubai. Murder and war crimes just for starters.
There's no place like home!!

"Oemig's move was a distraction." A distraction from what? From protecting and perserving our Constitution and civil liberties? How is that a distraction in any way?

Or... does David Postman believe impeachment would be a distraction from the Democrats pretending to oppose the Iraq war, and later turning around and providing President Bush with all the additional war-funding he continually seeks to keep the war going?

At least Senator Oemig is upholding his oath of office to protect the U.S. Constitution. If there was any president and vice president in history who deserve to be impeached for war crimes, and numerous assaults on our freedoms, it is Bush and Cheney.

The Seattle Times needs to stop acting as a lap-dog of the government and remember its traditional role as a watchdog of it.

The impeachment of these two men is not a distraction. They are more than a little guilty of impeachable acts. If what they did does not rise to the level of high crimes and misdemeanors, what does? And the American people deserve to see exactly what an impeachment investigation will uncover. Right now, we're all waiting till after the election to find out where everything these two did, how much power they abused, and how many people have actually been harmed. Bringing impeachment up in the House is not where they would be convicted, but it is definitely where the truth would come out. And if we did NOT impeach these two men, what would that say to others coming behind them?

Mr Bush AND Mr Cheney both should be brought before the US House and tried for the commission of numerous High Crimes and Misdemeanors. If they are allowed to walk away in January 2009 their abuses of power will lay the foundation for the further undermining of our Constitution by future Presidents. I certainly support Sen. Oemig's SJM 8016. How can upholding our US Constitution be considered a "distraction"?

Impeachment is not a distraction. Impeachment is also not a Democratic issue, it is a Constitutional one. How much time is left in the Bush administration is irrelevant. They have been violating the Constitution since they were in office. One day more is one too many. If you think one more year is not too bad, then you either care nothing for the Constitution, care nothing for this country, or are simply ignorant.

Thanks, Senator Oemig! Anyone who has a knee-jerk reaction against this should actually read the measure first.

Those who then insist that impeachment is a distraction would probably argue that investigating armed robberies needlessly distracts police from writing parking tickets.

The "little time" the Administration has left is irrelevant, Mr. Postman. The real question is: would the alledged offenses amount to high crimes? The answer is yes and, therefore, the Constitution demands impeachment hearings. It doesn't "suggest" them. And it certainly doesn't suggest nationwide prevaricating, white-washing, and head-in-sand-sticking.

Our state lawmakers and political representatives down to city officials have sworn to uphold the Constitution and all have a responsibility to preserve the law of the land. Sen. Oemig has outlined numerous, uncontentious flagrant Constitutional violations by the President and Vice-Presdent. To ignore this is unpatriotic and complicit in crime leaving the next administration to do the same.

Boy! A lot of folks been getting their marching orders and talking points from the netroots/DailyKus/MoveOn collective lately!

For a know-nothing, backbencher, freshman State Senator to go to Olympia and fail to properly represent his constituents on the important issues affecting them is one thing. But to waste the resources of Wasington State taxpers in a vanity move - that's right, he's in this not for any grand cause, but to get his name in the newspapers and pimp his political career - that's both spitting into the wind and without even a scintilla of legal foundation is entirely another.

All the "Bush lied, people died," or "No blood for oil" stuff are so many false cliches and mere opinions. There are NO impeachable offenses, and this is but an effort to effectively criminalize policy differences.

Don't agree? Remember, Senator Hillary Clinton voted to authorize President Bush's actions in Iraq.

The conspiracty theorists among the pro-impeachment tantrum throwers need to get a grip, or volumes on American history and law (can they read?) and finally wake up to the realization that just because George W. Bush infuriates them that doesn't qualify under Article II, Section 4 as "high crimes and misdemenors."

Further, from Speaker Pelosi on down to the third shift janitor at Kent's Regional Justice Center, the consensus among public officials is that not only is impeachment a non-starter (read political disaster) but inappropriate. And we needn't resurrect the slamming comments from every media outlet in town, through and including The Stranger, a real wingnut rag, that characterized Oemig's move as everything from "grandstanding" to "a stunt."

Oh, sure there are those uber-partisan hyenas who still fume over Bill Clinton's troubles and the 2000 election, but group therapy and perhaps psychotropic meds might be the order of the day, not phony and trumped up politically motivated impeachment charges against President Bush.

Get over it, people. George W. Bush was elected, and, while he's not the most popular of fellows at the moment, his term of office won't be over until January, 2009 no matter how many times your collectively pound your fists and feet upon the floor.

As to "Senator" Oemig? Agains, I live in the 45th District, he's my elected representative, and he's not only insulted the people of Eastern King County who sent him to Olympia, he engaged in bait and switch politics to get the chance to screw us over.

Not a single solitary indication was given by him during his campaign that he was Hell bent for leather to play - yep, play! - national politics once elected. He spared no effort to accuse his opponent, then Representative Toby Nixon, of being an extremist and he did so using some of the most vicious gutter politics I've seen in a long time.

The Dr. Jekyll-like moderate, middle-of-the-road, problem solving, non-ideological, bipartisan, "not the usual politician" who was elected became the Mr. Hyde-like rabid partisan almost immediately upon reaching Olympia.

In the history of the State of Washingtion, rarely has such a hypocritical display of political perfidy been on display. The rapidity with which Oemig launched his impeachment bid once he hit the rarified air of Olympia suggests that this was his plan and scheme all along, that he hid his intent from voters who wanted a State Senator, not a junior Inspector Javert.

Lest any think he's scoring points within his own party, I'm hearing otherwise...bigtime! This isn't going down well with those up for re-election who had hoped for a legislative session to bolster their campaigns, not embarress them.

Voters in the 45th won't have his name in their crosshairs for a couple years, but we will remember, and we will send a new State Senator to Olympia come January, 2011.

Oh...one more thing...if you think I'm disgusted, my army staff sergeant and Marine lance corporal sons found Oemig's original stunt so repulsive it made them ill. I'm not looking forward to breaking the news of this one to them. They regard his behavior as insulting to them and their fellow soldiers and Marines, and they'd just as soon he shut up!

Amen to that!

The Piper

The “Demand Impeachment Now” vote via the 44th LD internet forum.
44th LD vote: YES: 8, not voting: 2, NO: 2

1st LD vote: Yes: 1, no other votes

32nd LD 100% voted for impeachment

Democracy comes from the bottom up, not the top down.

We don't fight the crime of terrorism with 11 aircraft carriers.

My News and Views Newsletter: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NewsViewsnolose

My book a draft, http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SomeUnknownUSHistory/
Dick
Mill Creek,WA

Well, It'll take at least ten more years to kill the 300,000 or so Viet nam cost America so... let's go with politics as usual.

People who want to protect and defend the Constitution are proud of Eric Oemig. We have seen our rights whittled away as the Presidency as grabbed more and more power. No President or Vice President should have the power to decide which laws to obey and which to ignore. No President or Vice President should be able to engage in illegal spying against Americans. Nor President or Vice President should be able to have any American arrested and detained without due process and habeas corpus. Lastly, no American President should ever again get away with lying to take us into war.
Is Oemig doing the right thing? You bet.
I only hope that the Washington legislators take their oath of office seriously and act to protect and defend the Constitution by doing what they can do to force Congress to do its job in protecting and defending the Consitution. Protecting the Constitution is not a distraction.And yes, there is more than enough time for congress to investigate Bush and Cheney. The evidence is abundent!
I miss the Constitution. I want it back!

At last count, 81 young men and women from our state have died in this illegal war.

We can't ignore that. If they have died honorably, we need to be proud of them. If they have died in vain, we need to hold to account those resonsible for their deaths.

We need to know the truth.

Impeach.

Very curious...how many of you pro-impeachment types live in the 45th Legislative District? My guess is somewhere in the range of...zip!

Care to prove me wrong?

The Piper

Raise your hand if you prefer that in America, you want it easy for presidents and vice presidents to lie to start wars.

Even when the president is very inarticulate, even when the vice president is very unlikable.

If you fail to impeach Bush and Cheney, you condemn your kids to go fight and die in the next war based on lies.

A sincere note to Scott Piper, and all other asleep American citizens~

Sir: the following are IMPEACHABLE OFFENSES!
Waging illegal, immoral, UNCONSTITUTION wars.
Lying under oath to the American people.
Illegal wire tapping, spying, and torure.

Impeachment IS the legal remedy for tyranny! Elections don't end abuse of power by the Office of the Executive, only impeachment can do that.

As stated by many passionate US patriots:
Failing to impeach allows the next president to assume the dangerously expanded powers arrogated to the Executive Office by George Bush and Dick Cheney. Failure to impeach means the next President Clinton, Romney, Obama or Huckabee can continue to lie us into war, spy on American citizens, kidnap and torture people across the world, and destroy the economy for us and future generations.
Failure to impeach allows Bush and Cheney to run amok and continue to jeopardize the security of this nation. The recent charade in the Gulf of Hormuz is proof that Bush intends to provoke war with Iran at all costs.
The US Constitution requires protection now. Every American gains when the rule of law applies to all of us equally. That includes the President and the Vice President. Our standing in the world suffers, and diplomacy is made impossible when international treaties are violated with impunity.

We have plenty of time to impeach. It could happen in an afternoon. Congress proved last session that no bill of import will be passed until Bush and Cheney are impeached. If restoring the US Constitution is the only thing congress achieves this session, it would be enough.

It is appropriate for a state legislature to send a memorial to Congress asking them to take action. I'm thankful that many of our state legislators are strong enough to stand up for our laws and our rights. They have sworn an oath of office to protect the constitution. The state legislature is not a campaign committee, they have the duty to represent us and to defend the rule of law.

Impeachment is imperative. Let's start the hearings in the House Judiciary Committee immediately and let the investigations of serious allegations begin. Americans deserve to know the truth, our country will be better for it.
I'm only voting for candidates who have the courage to use impeachment to restore the rule of law.

Oy vay!
Seems like Oernig's mom has been mighty busy tonight thinking up a variety of names to post under.
Look--
Bush is President for 1 more year.
I am certainly not a fan of his....and am glad he is not running for a 3rd term. I would never vote for him.
But this country must stop these destructive political games the Daily Kos promotes.
Michael Bloomberg or some other 3rd Party candidate may be the answer.
You devout LEFTIST clowns are game-playing cowards....sitting in comfort while others do your heavy lifting in the military.
You make me sick.
This thread is a joke.
One person likely posted more than 1 of these comments.

Kim...

Tell it to a judge...and watch yourself get kicked out of the courtroom.

You'll be fulminating against George W. Bush until the end of time. No reasonableness, the truth of facts or the law or anything will persuade you of both how silly you look and how sillier your impeachment implosion really is.

Know this: my boys may disagree with him at times, but he is their Commander in Chief, and they respect him as that. My soldier son also says - I'm just adding this for good measure - that Gen. David Petraeus is the finest commander yet in the war, and what he's doing...is working!

I'm as aware and knowledgeable as any of you. In addition, my stake in this is very personal and so much higher than what any of you have in this that it isn't even funny: I have children on the line, how about any of you?

Still haven't heard that any of you live in the 45th District! Not surprising.

The Piper

To Impeach them and REMOVE them from office would be a BLESSING to all Americans.

I have lived in the 45th District for 25 years. I believe we should ask the Congress to investigate and determine if President Bush and Vice President Cheney committed impeachable offenses.

Oemig is a grandstander who clearly aspires to gain exposure for the ultimate goal of making a name for himself and ascending to higher office. He needs to quit focusing on federal issues and work on the job he actually has. It is no more his job to call for impeachment (or any other federal act) than it is for any of us. If he really cared about anything than his grandstanding he would realize there is nothing to gain by seeking impeachment this late in the administration's second term. If he is that concerned about national politics, he should instead get active in supporting his own candidate for president this year (Probably Dennis Kucinich). Mark my words, as soon as Patty or Maria retires, good ol' Oemig will probably be waiting in the wings to get out in front of the cameras.

Thank you Senator Oemig....impeachment is a constitutional imperative which can begin as a memorial in state legislatures...and WA can step up to the noble cause to restore our democracy.

Piper...you have said enough. Stop trying to hog the blogg.

Cheney and Bush getting away with all that they have done against our country and the rest of the world would be an indictment of Congress. We can expect more king-like leaders in the future if there is no impeachment.

Sue...

I'm sure The Times has enough bandwidth for lil' ol' me!

Oemig is a grandstander...

There are no impeachable offenses save the ones in all of your dreams...

If there was such a public groundswell for it, then politicians, who always react when you poke them with enough popular sentiment, would be all over it...

Impeachment is a hard left, bitterly partisan, thoroughly defeatist effort...

The impeachment strategists have nothing to offer in return...

It will do Oemig no good to wait in the wings since his political career will be terminated come the next election. He better learn to say, "Want fries with that?"...

Here's one I haven't mentioned to you...No matter who's elected President come November, the U.S. will have a massive presence in Iraq for a long time. The new President - Obama, HRC, McCain, FDT, makes no never mine - will still be in the business of killing terrorists, authorizing CIA actions that cause you all to go beserk, reading NSA electronic surveillance data, monitoring financial transactions with foreign nationals, authorizing third-country interrogations, and much, much, much more. Why? Because all this are necessary for the survival of the United States and the protection of its people against enemies who've sworn to kill us all because we are offensive to them. Get used to it...

Those of you who are offended by my comments and who tell me to disappear? How's that tolerance and diversity of viewpoint working out for you? I do and say what I do and say because it's the right thing. And I do it for my boys who find the whole impeachment charade hypocritical and sickening. But they serve, no thanks from any of you I've noticed, to protect your right to speak and act politically irrespective of how irresponsible and self-focused those actions are.

The Piper

Jeanne Large...

That's one of you. Now, where are the rest of them? How many of the other posters are 45th District residents?

The Piper

I do not see impeachment as a distraction, but as
an imperative. The Bush Administration has led us into an occupation of Iraq with knowingly false information, has authorized torture, has
done away with habeaus corpus and other civil
liberties. To simply allow the clock to run out
on this Administration without holding them responsible would be shirking our duties as
citizens. Any of the offenses listed above are
worthy of impeachment.

TALK ABOUT THE IMMEDIATE SAFETY AND WELFARE OF WASHINGTONIANS, just wait until Bush (the spawn of 'Turd Blossom') and his Chief Nazi over there at HOMELAND SECURITY cram their National ID supposed drivers' license down your ignorant, stupid throats!

HOORAY for Eric Oemig who knows impeachable and criminal offenses when he sees them!

The fabric of our Constitution is unraveling one thread at a time in exactly the same way that brought down all the other democracies that have vanished, including those within the past decade. Failure by a people to protect and defend their constitution by demanding the same from their elected officials promptly makes the constitution irrelevant, leaving all control of the people at the whim of the head of the armed forces. This will also prove inevitable in the United States if the people do not now protest apparent law-breaking by individuals in the executive branch in the strongest manner possible within our rules of law.

The argument that "it won't make any difference because Bush will be out of office within a year" begs the issue, which is whether the executive branch is immune to oversight by the legislative branch of our government. Woe be to our nation if it is, and everyone of us had better believe that by nipping this in the bud right now or we and our posterity will all be suffering the consequences - that is for sure!

As for name-calling those whose opinions may disagree with yours, I strongly suggest we all follow the rules of our legislatures and the congress and conduct our discourse in the spirit of comity; that means treating the other fellow with the same courtesy as you wish to be treated. Some people thought Thomas Edison was an idiot and told him so, but his light bulb still shed a lot of light! So if you have a better argument than Senator Oemig and many others on this issue please state it. Everyone needs to hear how well you can make your case.

We certainly can't be distracted by mere facts, from our efforts to craft great and significant legislation which we can pass with a veto-proof vote, so it can be subverted with yet another unconstitutional signing-statement. No, a million dead Iraqis in an illegal war for profiteers proves that!

I appreciate Senator Eric Oemig's courageous stand to pursue the impeachment of President Bush and Vice-President Cheney. At least there are a handful of people in government, like Dennis Kucinich, Robert Wexler & Oemig, trying to stave off a full-blown dictatorship. I used to think the Pelosi-crat Congress, which has overlooked a slew of obvious impeachable offenses, was just weak. They are not weak, they are the loyal right hand of the Bush rule. By the way, one year and one week is not a little time.

www.PartyofCommons.com

I notice that the nastier comments on this site may come from those who have a taste for war and torture and therefore see nothing wrong with what the Bush administration has done to this country and to the world in general. That being said, it is ABSOLUTELY the duty of the States and of the People to impeach George Bush and Dick Cheney! To do otherwise will have grave consequences.

Why? Because the enormity of what the Bush regime has perpetrated on the U.S. and the world cannot be undone, or cured, until these crimes have been brought under a microscope for the entire country and world to see. A microscope where these crimes are examined, investigated, probed and “cured”. It is only by holding those responsible for these crimes permanently accountable that there lies any hope for real change.

Here is a small list of the legacy of the Bush regime: fascism, theocracy, torture, imperialist domination of the Middle East, war crimes, crimes against humanity, abolishment of civil rights, corruption, the list goes on and on. The complicit mainstream media dares not to mention the long list of crimes of the Bush regime, or at the very least not mention them too long or too often. The high crimes and misdemeanors committed by this administration are blatant, they are obvious, they are monstrous, and they are cruel, but the mainstream media continues in its silence. Where is the call for justice? Without justice there will never be real change in this country. Without a resounding call from the people in the millions demanding this justice now change cannot occur.

While people here quibble over whether the State of WA should bother with impeachment, and allow themselves to be distracted by the '08 elections, the Bush regime continues on its course: soldiers, Iraqis, and Afghanis continue to die, Pakistan is in chaos, codified torture continues, the American people continue to be wire-tapped and put under suspicion, due process has been shredded, immigrants continue to be ripped from their families and deported, women’s reproductive rights continue to be eradicated, next to nothing is being done to stem the rising tide of global warming and it’s dire consequences for the whole of humankind. The election of a progressive candidate, even one who declares that he or she will reverse the fascistic trajectory of the Bush regime, cannot make real change occur unless the whole program of the Bush regime is repudiated. Unless the Bush regime is driven from office and held accountable for their crimes a precedent will be set that may be irreversible for all time.

This precedent will be one where no matter the action there will be no consequences. If George Bush & Dick Cheney cannot be impeached for torture, war crimes, treason, and corruption – what action by future presidents can ever be deemed impeachable? What action could a future president ever undertake that would be considered a crime if the blatantly criminal behavior of the Bush regime is never held accountable? Therein lies the danger of allowing Bush to continue his term unchallenged, and un-investigated. To allow Bush & Cheney to finish their term without being brought to justice lessens the possibility of ever holding any of his regime accountable for their crimes OR ANY FUTURE REGIME!

I notice that the nastier comments on this site may come from those who have a taste for war and torture and therefore see nothing wrong with what the Bush administration has done to this country and to the world in general. That being said, it is ABSOLUTELY the duty of the States and of the People to impeach George Bush and Dick Cheney! To do otherwise will have grave consequences.

Why? Because the enormity of what the Bush regime has perpetrated on the U.S. and the world cannot be undone, or cured, until these crimes have been brought under a microscope for the entire country and world to see. A microscope where these crimes are examined, investigated, probed and “cured”. It is only by holding those responsible for these crimes permanently accountable that there lies any hope for real change.

Here is a small list of the legacy of the Bush regime: fascism, theocracy, torture, imperialist domination of the Middle East, war crimes, crimes against humanity, abolishment of civil rights, corruption, the list goes on and on. The complicit mainstream media dares not to mention the long list of crimes of the Bush regime, or at the very least not mention them too long or too often. The high crimes and misdemeanors committed by this administration are blatant, they are obvious, they are monstrous, and they are cruel, but the mainstream media continues in its silence. Where is the call for justice? Without justice there will never be real change in this country. Without a resounding call from the people in the millions demanding this justice now change cannot occur.

While people here quibble over whether the State of WA should bother with impeachment, and allow themselves to be distracted by the '08 elections, the Bush regime continues on its course: soldiers, Iraqis, and Afghanis continue to die, Pakistan is in chaos, codified torture continues, the American people continue to be wire-tapped and put under suspicion, due process has been shredded, immigrants continue to be ripped from their families and deported, women’s reproductive rights continue to be eradicated, next to nothing is being done to stem the rising tide of global warming and it’s dire consequences for the whole of humankind. The election of a progressive candidate, even one who declares that he or she will reverse the fascistic trajectory of the Bush regime, cannot make real change occur unless the whole program of the Bush regime is repudiated. Unless the Bush regime is driven from office and held accountable for their crimes a precedent will be set that may be irreversible for all time.

This precedent will be one where no matter the action there will be no consequences. If George Bush & Dick Cheney cannot be impeached for torture, war crimes, treason, and corruption – what action by future presidents can ever be deemed impeachable? What action could a future president ever undertake that would be considered a crime if the blatantly criminal behavior of the Bush regime is never held accountable? Therein lies the danger of allowing Bush to continue his term unchallenged, and un-investigated. To allow Bush & Cheney to finish their term without being brought to justice lessens the possibility of ever holding any of his regime accountable for their crimes OR ANY FUTURE REGIME!

Looks like it's Piper against the world. Who will the Rs run against Eric in the 45th to defend Bush and Cheney?

P.S.

I almost missed that next-to-last comment in Postman's article:

"Even Democrats sympathetic to the cause said last year that Oemig’s move was a distraction."

When defending the United States Constitution becomes a distraction to legislators ... well, that's a sad commentary on the state of the nation.

www.PartyofCommons.com

I've had enough.
I'm sick of the lies.
I'm tired of the scandals.
I'm angry at the loss of civil liberties.

Scandals like the US Attorneys' firings,
the Walter Reed outpatients,
the Katrina debacle.
Pardoning Scooter Libby, who outed an undercover CIA agent.
Voter suppression.
The War on Science.
Theocracy.
Corruption.
The War on the Environment.
Food safety.
Toy safety.
The Pat Tillman coverup.
Terri Schiavo.
700+ signing statements.

The lies.
Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and Powell lied to the Congress,
the American people, and the world,
when they told us there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
There were no ties between Saddam Hussein and Al Qaeda.
Thousands of American troops are dead,
tens of thousands are maimed,
and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis are dead.
Now they're trying to instigate a war on Iran.

Do you miss your civil liberties?
The PATRIOT Act is an Orwellian nightmare.
What about the "quaint" Geneva Conventions?
Extraordinary rendition, torture, and the loss of habeas corpus.
Illegal wiretapping of US citizens.

Where is the outrage?
It's been a slow-motion coup for the last seven years.

We can't fire Bush.
We can't try him in court.
We can't have a recall election
or a vote of no confidence.

We should impeach him for these crimes:
lying us into Iraq;
torturing prisoners;
and illegally wiretapping US citizens.

Yes, it will be ugly.
But if we continue to leave him in office,
we become complicit.
We already failed one test in the 2004 election.
Impeachment will restore US moral authority.
Leaving him in office sends the wrong message.

Military personnel and office holders take
an oath to support and defend the Constitution.

We can defend the Constitution by Impeaching this President.

If congress ignores the mandate in the constitution to impeach based on serious evidence of high crimes (like cherry picking evidence and deceiving congress into a war) then congress is also liable for the high crime of obstructing justice!

I ask those so called non partisans who claim partisanship what would it take for them to believe hearings should be held?

Oh that's right, things are only unlawful when their competitor party does it.

I am amazed how the criminal behavior of the Bush Crime Family is excused. We have never had a criminal enterprise in the Whitehouse that can touch these thugs.Harding and Nixon come to mind ,but they were minor Pikers compared to this gang.Impeach,Indicit, Try then send them to that "Island paradise at Guatanamo"

When you vote for a dope smoking commie, you get a dope-smoking commie fruitcake. what do you expect? sheesh, mon.

mon dieu postman...you really know how to bring out the fruitcakes don't you? well, that's what seattle is known for, fruit loops, fruitcakes, commies, marxists, lenin-lovers. seattle-tacoma never saw a commie they didn't like...:) and they all love their dope, too...

Trying to oust war criminals who have systematically tried to destroy the Constitution is never a "distraction." Perhaps you aren't paying attention to the big picture, but others are.

Laughable:

"Waging illegal, immoral, UNCONSTITUTION wars"

Sorry---but the war is not illegal. Immorality (in your opinion) is not an impeachable offense. The previous administration is proof of that. Last the war is not unconstitutional (or unconstitution as you put it) as Congress granted the authority to the White House to proceed. While it may feed your seven year long temper tantrum and ego to scream for impeachement, that does not mean you have reached a logical conclusion from cogent, unbiased analysis.

"Illegal wire tapping, spying, and torure." Uh, sorry it's not illegal. You can scream and yell all you want about waterboarding, but as the law stands now it is not illegal. If it was, then those individuals that demonstrated it in Westlake on Friday would have been arrested right?
And the opinion of Amnesty International does not change the statutes. When the Iraqi Army routinely violated the Geneva Convention were you screaming then? Of course not---it didn't sate your predisposed animus (thus lacking rationality) for the President.

"Lying under oath to the American people." Really? You've got to be kidding me. After all, the previous administration argued succesfully that perjury and subornation of perjury is not an impeachable offense. The topic of the perjury is irrelevant. It is rather classicly humourous that the malcontentsia consider that the President is dumber than dirt, but apparently he has the mental faculties to outsmart them time and time again. Oh right, it's Cheney, Bush 41, Halliburton, Black Water, "Big Oil", Skull and Bones Society, blah, blah, blah...

President Bush and Vice-President Cheney will never, ever be impeached for there are no grounds for impeachment. Just ask Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid. Sorry that your temper tantrum isn't working---most toddlers learn that rather rquickly.

The real distraction is the election and the so called mainstream media ignoring this issue. If we don't impeach, the next president, no matter what party, will inherit the precedent setting executive powers this administration has criminalized. This is not a partisan issue, it is upholding the constitution, what every politian pledges in his oath upon taking office. Good for Sen. Oemig, a true patriot!

Postman, as he did last year, is claiming along with some of the state's Congressional delegation, including Sen. Patty Murray and Rep. TK, that Sen. Oemig's resolution calling for the House to begin impeachment hearings against President Bush is a "diversion" from the Congressional Democrats' "important agenda."
Well, that is what they said when they killed Sen. Oemig's resolution last spring, and what did Congress then accomplish in its impeachment-free session? Did they end the war? No. Did they restore the Constitution and the Bill of Rights? No. Did they put an end to Bush's blatant usurpation of the Congress's legislative authority by banning his use of signing statements to ignore laws passed by the Congress? No. Did they do anything of consequence? No.
In fact, they endorsed an expansion of the war in Iraq, effectively gave Bush a green light to attack Iran's Revolutionary Guard, retroactively authorized Bush's illegal program of warrantless spying on Americans, and left signing statements untouched. Indeed, the current Congress has been the most pathetic "opposition" Congress in modern memory.
Given what it has done, we might have been better off had it been "diverted" from its activities.
Now we're being told again that Sen. Oemig's call for impeachment, if passed and acted upon, would be a "diversion." Let's hope so! Congress has no more important business than defending the Constitution and the rule of law. If it fails to do so, and lets this criminal and usurping administration leave office untouched by even an impeachment hearing, it will have endorsed Bush's and Cheney's behavior as appropriate for all future presidents.
We will no longer be living in the same country that the Founders gave us.
People like Postman are a disgrace to the name of journalist. Tom Paine and Peter Zenger must be cringing in their graves.
(Dave Lindorff is author of "The Case for Impeachment", published in 2006 by St. Martin's Press. His work is available at www.thiscantbehappening.net)

The Constitution states, "The President, Vice President and all civil Officers of the United States, shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and Conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other high Crimes and Misdemeanors."

Is there sufficient evidence to bring impeachment proceedings? One question we might ask ourselves is, "What do we hold more important; symbols of power or the Constitution of the United States?"

It seems to me, based on the evidence I have seen, that there is evidence of at least Misdemeanors, and quite probably high Crimes. Why should Congress not begin proceedings, and let the evidence be presented before them.

I find it very odd that somehow the Iraq war is considered an impeachable offense. If so, then you are willing to oust the Democrats that voted for the war, correct? Here is a list of all the Democrats that voted yes for the war in Iraq. Of those that are still in office, how many are you willing to oust? Oh right, President Bush, that simpleton, was able to 'dupe' them all (again). If you want to impeach the President, but none of the people below, then you are a hypocrite, and a partisan, and lack the credibility to speak out against the President.

YES (29): Baucus (MT), Bayh (IN), Biden (DE), Breaux (LA)*, Cantwell (WA), Carnahan (MO)*, Carper (DE), Cleland (GA)*, Clinton (NY), Daschle (SD)*, Dodd (CT), Dorgan (ND), Edwards (NC)*, Feinstein (CA), Harkin (IA), Hollings (SC)*, Johnson (SD), Kerry (MA), Kohl (WI), Landrieu (LA), Lieberman (CT), Lincoln (AR), Miller (GA)*, Nelson (FL), Nelson (NE), Reid (NV), Rockefeller (WV), Schumer (NY), Torricelli (NJ)*.

There are no grounds for impeachment---but your hysteria is humourous.

Contrary to what people who denigrate Senator Oemig in their comments on this blog, I know that this Administration headed up by the so-called President, George W. Bush, and his so-called Vice-President, Richard B. Cheney, are quite guilty of many impeachable crimes. I was the Chief Actuary of Social Security for 19 years before I retired at the beginning of 2001, just a few days before they took office. I personally know several very high-level Republicans, even, who have had very serious issues with this very corrupt Administration! I heartily applaud Senator Oemig for his timely action to impeach the very worst (President Carter was quite right to label President George W. Bush as "the worst ever!") Administration in this great Nation's history! While I know of many crimes they have committed, and I suspect even more heinous things have been done by them that I do not know about, I sincerely believe the truth is far, far worse than I could ever imagine! Senator Oemig should be given kudos, NOT criticism!

Funny how inder the previous administration this wasn't an "impeachable" offense:

Warrantless "National Security" Searches

The Clinton administration claims that it can bypass the warrant clause for "national security" purposes. In July 1994 Deputy Attorney General Jamie S. Gorelick told the House Select Committee on Intelligence that the president "has inherent authority to conduct warrantless searches for foreign intelligence purposes." [51] According to Gorelick, the president (or his attorney general) need only satisfy himself that an American is working in conjunction with a foreign power before a search can take place.

The warrant clause was designed to give the American people greater security than that afforded by the mere words of politicians. It requires the attorney general, or others, to make a showing of "probable cause" to a magistrate. The proponents of national security searches are hard-pressed to find any support for their position in the text or history of the Constitution. That is why they argue from the "inherent authority" of the Oval Office--a patently circular argument. The scope of such "authority" is of course unbounded in principle. Yet the Clinton Justice Department has said that the warrant clause is fully applicable to murder suspects but not to persons suspected of violating the export control regulations of the federal government. [52] If the Framers had wanted to insert a national security exception to the warrant clause, they would have done so. They did not.

The Clinton administration's national security exception to the warrant clause is nothing more, of course, than an unsupported assertion of power by executive branch officials. The Nixon administration relied on similar constitutional assertions in the 1970s to rationalize "black bag" break-ins to the quarters of its political opponents. [53] The Clinton White House--even after the Filegate scandal--assures Congress, the media, and the general public that it has no intention of abusing this power.

Attorney General Reno has already signed off on the warrantless search of an American home on the basis of the dubious "inherent authority" theory. [54] The actual number of clandestine "national security" searches conducted since 1993 is known only to the White House and senior Justice Department officials.

Nor this:
Warrantless Wiretapping

The Supreme Court has recognized that electronic surveillance, such as wiretapping and eavesdropping, impinges on the privacy rights of individuals and organizations and is therefore subject to the Fourth Amendment's warrant clause. [65] President Clinton, however, has asked Congress to pass legislation that would give the Federal Bureau of Investigation the power to use "roving wiretaps" without a court order. [66] The president also fought for sweeping legislation that is forcing the telephone industry to make its network more easily accessible to law enforcement wiretaps. Those initiatives have led ACLU officials to describe the Clinton White House as "the most wiretap-friendly administration in history." [67]

It is unclear why the president made warrantless roving wiretaps a priority matter since judges routinely approve wiretap applications by federal prosecutors. According to a 1995 report by the Administrative Office of U.S. Courts, it had been years since a federal district court turned down a prosecutor's request for a wiretap order. [68] President Clinton is apparently seeking to free his administration from any potential judicial interference with its wiretapping plans. There is a problem, of course, with the power that the president desires: it is precisely the sort of unchecked power that the Fourth Amendment's warrant clause was designed to curb. As the Supreme Court noted in Katz v. United States (1967), the judicial procedure of antecedent justification before a neutral magistrate is a "constitutional precondition," not only to the search of a home, but also to eavesdropping on private conversations within the home. [69]

President Clinton also lobbied for and signed the Orwellian Communications Assistance for Law Enforcement Act, which is forcing every telephone company in America to retrofit its phone lines and networks so that they will be more accessible to police wiretaps. [70] The cost of that makeover is expected to be several billion dollars. Any communications carrier that fails to meet the technology standards of the attorney general can be fined up to $10,000 per day. The passage of that law prompted Attorney General Reno to marvel at her newly acquired power: "I don't think J. Edgar Hoover would contemplate what we can do today." [71] That is unfortunately true. In the past, law enforcement had to rely on the goodwill and voluntary cooperation of the American people for investigative assistance. That tradition is giving way to a regime of coercive mandates. [72]

I have no problem taking on the lot of the impeachment mob. What with their incorrect facts ("Scooter Libbey...outed a CIA agent." No he didn't, that was Richard Armitage. Ask Bob Novak since it was to him that Valerie Plame was outed) complete ignorance of the law, and hyperventilating fulminations, they'll politically burn themselves to a crisp.

A lot of the same stuff was said about Lincoln in his day by Copperheads. History took care of Lincoln and his grit and determination, and, in the same way, at least on the prescient wisdom of taking a stand in Iraq and Afghanistan, it will similarly regard President Bush.

But Eric Oemig? The Vidkun Quisling of our time, that's who he is. If you want to talk about a back stabber, talk about how he back stabbed his 45th District constituents, how, instead of delivering as he promised, he's squandering OUR time and OUR money playing ideologically driven gutter politics in Olympia.

Ain't gonna be no impeachment, punkin heads! Unless, that is, we can gin up a resolution against Oemig for his lies, deception, failure to honor his campaign promises, and more.

That he's been a figurative knee in the collective crotch of American soldiers, Marines, sailors, airmen, and Coasties is also a seething, burning issue.

Someone mentioned Dennis Kucinich in connection with Oemig's name. The difference between the two is at least Kucinich knows he's nothing but a UFO-seeing political Smurf who'll never get above single digits as a Demo Prexy candidate. Oemig, on the other hand, deludes himself into thinking that he's making a difference and that he matters.

In a couple words, NOT and NOT!

Oemig's chickens will come home to roost, and in his case, where it does it will also roast.

So, impeachment impressarios, give it your best shot, beat your breasts, shout and holler, give us your fullest expression of outrage over empty accusations, and continue to demand lynch-mob-like what the ballot box won't give you irrespective of party affiliation. In the end, all you'll have is a lot uf un-read books, silly sounding position papers, and a legacy for the future that's nothing more than inheriting the wind.

The Piper

If the Bush Administration is not impeached it sets a precedent that a tyrannical Executive Branch is OK, and it is the end of our country's great experiment in a government of the people. Democrats don't support Senator Oemig because they are just waiting to get "one of their own" into office, and Republicans don't support him because they are too dumb to understand that what they sow - is what they shall reap.

Ifimpeachment such a daggum DISTRACTION from such daggum other important stuff the Congress is NOT doing, then what is this DISTRACTING blog opinion on what a daggum DISTRACTION it would be except a DISTRACTION? Sorry if what a substantial portion of the public thinks is RIGHT and legal enforcement the CONSTITUTION and PROTECTION OF OUR LIBERTIES are a DISTRACTION, but obviously this paper is getting enough such DISTRACTING mail on the topic it felt obliged to respond with this pointless DISTRACTING opinion on how DISTRACTING it would be. If it's so distracting , just ignore, don't waste time talking about it all. Just hush up and be good little mouthpieces.

Perhaps the short time for the "Bush Administration" isn't so short. With Obama and Clinton having called for missle strikes on Iran, and a cozy bunch of advisors like Kissinger in their campaigns, the differences between them and Bush may be less than you think.
Impeachment as an election issue would provide a simple method of detecting the status quo candidate from the "something is truly wrong and needs fundamental repair" candidates.
The failure to impeach the funny guy in the white house is not a trifling or short term matter, His policies will endure, having been voted into existence with huge bipartisan majorities.
You might want to edit out the hate from the responses, it doesn't add much
- "nutbags" etc....

I spent eight years "supporting and defending the Constitution of the United States". As a Sergeant of Marine Infantry, I did that by obeying all legal orders and disobeying all illegal orders. I'm damned pissed that the exact opposite can be said about the President of the United States.

Bush is putting corporations above the Constitution; and many others are putting career before their oath to the Constitution.

Impeach Bush and Cheney and investigate and indict others as necessary.

Semper pacificus,

It's a good thing all of our traffic congestion and ferry problems have been solved so we can waste time on this completely useless "issue".

Enough with this so-called legislator. Fire Oemig and get someone else to give Redmond the representation it deserves.

Proceed with the impeachment or let us forever be known as the nation that allows thieves to serve in our highest offices.

You're completely out of step with the sentiment of the people on this. I'd advise you to check out the thinking of the majority of Washingtonians before publishing such biased drivel.

If War Crimes and Crimes Against Humanity are NOT a reason to impeach, than what is?
Read this Statement from World Can't Wait, Drive Out The Bush Regime

Seven years into the Bush administration, the conscience of the world is shocked by the crimes and destruction the American people have allowed to be carried out in our names: Iraq in ruins, torture codified, due process shredded, and the science of global warming suppressed as the future of the planet itself hangs in the balance. When, two years ago, we issued a Call to Drive Out the Bush Regime, even we did not anticipate the pace, cruelty and extremeness with which this program would advance and expand.

Today, impervious to the repeated pronouncements that he is a lame duck, George Bush is unrelenting in his determination to drive the savageness of his agenda into the next administration. If the consensus of the National Intelligence Estimate has put an unexpected road bump in Bush’s intent to conduct as many as 1,000 air strikes on Iran, it has also served to warn the public just how close we have come to another war predicated on a lie. Already the regime is redoubling its efforts to come up with new reasons to justify the outbreak of hostilities. This is still a president serene in his belief that he is on “God’s mission.” A war time president making use of unbridled executive power. A tyrant with his hands still on the levers of power.

Under the Military Commissions Act, passed by Congress in 2006, anyone the President decides to declare an enemy combatant can be disappeared into secret prisons without the right to know what crime he has been charged with and without the right to see his lawyer. And in this never-land where George Bush claims “We Do Not Torture” a detainee will be methodically robbed of his senses. He may be subjected to “stress positions” such as tying his arms behind his back and being strung from the top of a cage; he may subjected to electrical shocks, sexually degraded and deprived of sleep to the point where humans lose sanity. He may also be a she -- or as young as the 14-year-olds held in Guantanamo. The tapes destroyed by the C.I.A. document the commission of water-boarding and crimes against humanity.

The last seven years have also shown this to be true: There will be no savior from the Democratic Party. No "viable candidate" is calling for the immediate repeal of the Military Commissions Act or the Patriot Act. Clinton and Obama are not planning to dismantle the Department of Homeland Security’s domestic surveillance apparatus or the permanent U.S. military bases newly strung across the Middle East and Africa. The candidates for Commander-in-Chief are campaigning to better prosecute, not end, the so-called war on terror, a war promised to span generations. The election of 2008 will not be remembered for the candidate who campaigned to return the diaspora of black families displaced by natural disaster and criminal neglect back home to New Orleans. It is already remarkable for the regular bashing of immigrants.

There will be no pendulum swing when Democratic contenders join Republicans in lacing their speeches with professions of their faith, when Democrats seek common ground with religious fanatics who do not believe in evolution and want to see the church as state. There will be no pendulum swing when Democrats show tolerance for judicial nominees and “moral” agendas that are targeting the most fundamental rights of women to abortion and birth control for obliteration.

Official politics have proven to be a disaster. Your government does not want what you want and the Democratic nominee of 2008 will not speak for us.

THIS JANUARY join with us in mounting what has been gravely missing from political, ethical and cultural life in this country for the last 4 years – the voice of the people who refuse to be ruled in this way.

World Can’t Wait calls on all those who have shared a sense of collective outrage and shame - who would rise tomorrow if they believed there was a way to really change things - to do the only thing that is actually realistic. We can and must through mass political resistance create a political situation where this criminal regime is driven from office before their term is up - and the whole fascistic direction George Bush has been taking society is reversed. Only people highly mobilized and motivated by values that repudiate unjust war, bigotry and greed can bring the Bush agenda to a halt. Only the people who will not remain silent when their government tortures, terrorizes whole peoples and moves to quash dissent and critical thinking can change the course of history.

It’s up to us. We must show it or it doesn’t count. It begins with you taking personal responsibility to show how you feel and where you stand: wear orange daily, spread orange everywhere, protest and speak out in every way you can. As this orange resistance spreads to millions who represent the majority sentiment, Bush and Cheney's illegitimacy to rule will stand out vividly before the world.

This January the world needs to see that the people of this country rise to say NO to torture. Torture is a crime against humanity. Torture is an impeachable offense, ordered by the White House and still being sanctioned by Congress.

We Must Act Now - The Future Is In the Balance
The world can’t wait and it’s counting on You!
Drive Out the Bush Regime.

www.worldcantwait.org

It's a shame Postman has to frame this by quoting unattributed "Democrats sympathetic to the cause" who view this as a "distraction."

When my local Democratic club voted on this the vote was more than 100 in favor to 1 opposed. The results seem mirrored around the state.

If we allow the current administration to repeatedly violate the law, and do nothing about it, we set the stage for an unaccountable government as the norm.

We're luck to have a Senator like Eric Oemig pushing for this.

There is no more of an iconic figure in the Democratic Party than Franklin Delano Roosevelt. Really, he created the modern Democratic Party through the coalitions he assembled, and his thumbprint is fully impressed upon today's American understanding of the role of government.

While I'll quibble about the virtue of that all day and well into the night, I won't quibble with his skill as a wartime leader, and it's to that end I draw your attention to Ex parte Quirin, 317 U.S. 1 (1942).

A German U-Boat off-loaded a gang of saboteurs onto Long Island for the express purpose of blowing stuff up, causing trouble, and depressing morale. Not the cleverest of chaps - one actually ratted out the rest - they were quickly apprehended.

At FDR's express direction, they were tried before a military tribunal, convicted, and all save a couple electrocuted within two months of capture. No muss, no fuss, no bother!

A unanimous - for those of you who have difficulty with big words, that means all of them - SCOTUS held that FDR was well within his rights as CinC to convene military tribunals, try enemy saboteurs before them, and have them executed. Furthermore, the Court held that these individuals were not entitled to the Constitutional rights normally accorded civilian defendents in federal criminal proceedings, mentioning, inter alia, that if uniformed military personnel are not so entitled under the UCMJ, neither should those who wage war - actively or passively, it makes no difference - be so entitled.

Perhaps the most liberal Justice to ever sit on SCOTUS, William O. Douglas, concurred in the opinion and reasoning of the case.

Read selected passages from Mr. Justice Stone's opinion:

"Citizenship in the United States of an enemy belligerent does not relieve him from the consequences of a belligerency which is unlawful because in violation of the law of war. Citizens who associate themselves with the military arm of the enemy government, and with its aid, [317 U.S. 1, 38] guidance and direction enter this country bent on hostile acts are enemy belligerents within the meaning of the Hague Convention and the law of war"

***

"We cannot say that Congress in preparing the Fifth and Sixth Amendments intended to extend trial by jury to the cases of alien or citizen offenders against the law of war otherwise triable by military commission, while withholding it from members of our own armed forces charged with infractions of the Articles of War punishable by death. It is equally inadmissible to construe the Amendments- [317 U.S. 1, 45] whose primary purpose was to continue unimpaired presentment by grand jury and trial by petit jury in all those cases in which they had been customary-as either abolishing all trials by military tribunals, save those of the personnel of our own armed forces, or what in effect comes to the same thing, as imposing on all such tribunals the necessity of proceeding against unlawful enemy belligerents only on presentment and trial by jury. We conclude that the Fifth and Sixth Amendments did not restrict whatever authority was conferred by the Constitution to try offenses against the law of war by military commission, and that petitioners, charged with such an offense not required to be tried by jury at common law, were lawfully placed on trial by the Commission without a jury."

***

"…the law of war draws a distinction between the armed forces and the peaceful populations of belligerent nations and also between those who are lawful and unlawful combatants. Lawful combatants are subject to capture and detention as prisoners of war by opposing military forces. Unlawful combatants are likewise subject to capture and detention, but in addition they are subject to trial and punishment by military tribunals for acts which render their belligerency unlawful. The spy who secretly and without uniform passes the military lines of a belligerent in time of war, seeking to gather military information and communicate it to the enemy, or an enemy combatant who without uniform comes secretly through the lines for the purpose of waging war by destruction of life or property, are familiar examples of belligerents who are generally deemed not to be entitled to the status of prisoners of war, but to be offenders against the law of war subject to trial and punishment by military tribunals."

War is serious business not to be made sport of for partisan political gain, which is exactly what the pro-impeachment crowd seeks to do. If this were, say, President Obama's war with similar tactics and strategies, I've no doubt we wouldn't hear a peep from them.

The Piper

Piper -

No doubt you feel threatened by people speaking in favor of impeachment, as evidenced by your many posts on this forum. And no doubt you live in fear just as the government wish you to live.

Senator Oemig is representing his constituents by putting forth this impeachment resolution. It wasn't his idea. Hopefully Patty Murray will keep her nose OUT of this local process this year.

Poster Kristi Brown says, "Senator Oemig is a cankor sore to the political process!!! He had no influence last year when he pulled this nutso stunt in the State Senate and this year will likly prove the same. Call it quits Oemig!"

Well, Kristi Brown, I've got news for you. Senator Oemig is a duly elected representative. And guess what? He's representing his consitituents by putting forth this Joint Memorial. Like most people, unlike most Republicans, I take impeachment hearings very seriously. I don't view it as a stunt as you do. I view it as a Constitutional remedy for a President and Vice President who are acting more like Oil Executives than like representatives of the People. Unlike the Republicans, who sadly, pushed for the impeachment of Bill Clinton and hunted him down for the years he was in office, this President will be impeached fully aware that what he is doing is unConstitutional and illegal.

I echo what Linda 1-14-08 said.

Vice President Cheney and President Bush are
a CANCER that is causing you and I and all the people of the USA as well as other contry's to spiral down into an abiss of darkness. I have had ENOUGH! If they were removed we would be able to get our Constitutional Sovereign rights back into balance. This whole contry needs healing NOW. First the cancer must be removed.
Then the healing can take place. We want Peace.

"So, impeachment impressarios, give it your best shot, beat your breasts, shout and holler, give us your fullest expression of outrage over empty accusations, and continue to demand lynch-mob-like what the ballot box won't give you irrespective of party affiliation. In the end, all you'll have is a lot uf un-read books, silly sounding position papers, and a legacy for the future that's nothing more than inheriting the wind."

Piper, couldn't agree more. If there were an impeachable offense committed, the D's would have attacked long ago. These people on this blog just hate Bush, which of course is not a reason for impeachment. There have been no impeachable acts, only these conjured up by the Leftist Seattle Libs.

BUSH Lied Whaaaaaahhh....

Pleeeez, I can hardly wait until a D is in the White House just so I don't have to hear these sniveling whiners anymore. The difference, and what they hate about Bush vs. say Bill Clinton, is that he actually does something, that is to say, he does what he says he'll do, I know they can't relate to that amount of integrity and courage, they would rather have someone sit in the Oval office and think about who's under the desk...

Many people, such as myself, believe that George Bush and Dick Cheney have committed impeachable offenses against the people and Constitution of the United States.

By lying to get us into a war that has now killed far more Americans than 9/11 (let alone Iraqis and Afghanis), by subverting the laws of the land in the suspension of habaeus corpus, by illegally wiretapping American citizens and then lying about it, by subverting the separation of powers and the nature of American government through such underhanded practices as "signing statements," by relentlessly playing crony to big business, by weaving a web of lies and secrecy over every aspect of government, and most of all by destroying what little credibility Americans and the rest of the world placed in the American government and spirit of civic responsibility, George Bush has done more than any President in history to tarnish America's reputation.

He deserves to be impeached. It is our DUTY to impeach him. I wouldn't care if he had one day -- one HOUR -- left in office. Everything isn't always "realpolitik" and pragmatic; sometimes you have to take a stand and say "NO. This is WRONG."

And what Bush has done is WRONG, no two ways about it. He deserves to be impeached, and kudos to any politician (of any party!) with the guts to put principles before politics, to stand up to the yawning masses, and to say "we will not tolerate criminal behavior, even -- especially -- on the part of our President."

To those (of whatever political affiliation, although it does seem to be mainly Republican, reading the comments) who crow about how we (impeachment supporters) will never get the votes, and how it will never happen, I have a shocking admission for you:

You're probably right. Realistically? We won't impeach George Bush. The talking heads in Washington D.C. will continue to wag their tongues and fingers at him, while doing nothing. The next -- most likely Democrat -- President will probably quietly take over doing some of the same corrupt practices that Bush has pioneered and (through his non-impeachment) legitamized (there's your legacy, Bush -- you made corruption acceptable. Hooray!)

So -- he'll get away with it.

But if that makes you happy, then you're probably the kind of person who thinks that just because you can cheat in a marriage or steal from your work, and get away with it, then it must be okay. I mean, you got away with it, right?

Just because impeachment will fail doesn't mean impeachment is wrong. In fact, impeachment is the only moral course of action for those who seriously believe that Bush and Cheney are a bunch of crooks who make Nixon look like a saint. And, for the record, I'd say that whether he was Republican or Democrat.

Get it through your thick skulls (and yes, that is an insult, enjoy) -- WRONG is WRONG. Whether you get caught or not. Whether you're a Republican or a Democrat. Whether popular opinion supports you or not.

WRONG is WRONG. At least for Presidents, we have a response to repeated wrongdoing -- and it's called impeachment.

Richard Borkowski,
Funny how you think oemig is representing his district since you live in Seattle and not Kirkland. oemig is a grandstanding far left liberal who is out of touch with reality. I am sure there are more important issues that deserve his limited mindset.

Oh moonbats. Still itching for that impeachment. Unfortunately for you there is that pesky little document called the U. S. Constitution. The aformentioned requires that there be high crimes and misdemeanors present for impeachment. Sorry, those don't exist beyond your moronic "Bush lied people died " mantra. Try shelving you BDS long enough to grow up and join the rest of us adults.

Whoa...Richard Borkowski...Whoa...calm down all right. Thanks for sharing your opinion, we are "all" entitled to our opinions. Those elected to the State Legislature should focus on WA State issues only like fixing the *horrible* Viaduct and *horrible* 520 Bridge mess. Senator Oemig is trying to do what Maria and Patty should be called on to do in the other WA.

Borkowski...

Threatened by people who demand impeachment? Nah! I'm never threatened by those who come to the battle of wits unarmed.

But I genuinely feel sorry for all you imp imps because you're being played for suckers.

"Free beer!" trumpets the advertisement, "All the beer you can drink all day long. Just come to our event in Saskatoon, and the tap will flow non-stop just for you!"

Just how the Hell are you going to get to Saskatoon? The price of a ticket will cost you more than all the beer you could drink in a day, but ain't he a nice fella for putting on such a swell soiree? You think, "If he ever runs for office, I'll contribute to his campaign; he speaks for me because I like free beer!"

Problem is...there was no beer, only flyers...and suckers.

Eric Oemig knows full well his impeachment effort will sink like a manhole cover in a lake, which is fine with him since, like his campaign, his true intent is no doubt to use the effort as bait before a switch.

He's going to need lots of dough come 2010, and the frothy-mouthed out there among you will fall all over yourselves - mortgage the house, dip into junior's college fund, rob banks - to overload him with campaign kwan.

Since he can't raise money on his record of "accomplishments" (Hello! Anybody home???), he'll do it by waving the bloody shirt of impeachment now then cash in on it later.

I've accused him of being a conniving politician, I never said he was dumb. That I'll reserve for those who fall for this stunt.

Really, this isn't all that hard to figure out. It's a variation on the old "Biafran Baby Close," a fund raising gimmick where a starving child appears on the TV and a voice essentially says, "If this child dies, it's your fault!" So you run to the phone, call the 800 number and max out your Visa in order to assuage your guilt.

Oemig's take on it has him cast as a lone crusader who's beaten down by the establishment on both sides of the aisle. Still, he soldiers on, martyr to the cause that he is.

Won't you help him? Won't you ensure that his shining star in the legislative firmament will not be extinguished any time soon? All you need do is call 1-800-BADBUSH and pledge $100 (or whatever) a month for the rest of your life. In return for which, he'll send you a napkin from the State Senate Dining Room that he personally used to wipe his mouth that you can then place upon your TV. The warmth of the TV will cause the napkin to release the aroma of his lunch offering on the day he received your generous gift.

Won't you call today? Netroot-trained operators are standing by.

Bilious humbug!

The Piper

My only to this is that it comes 7 years too late to be of sufficient merit.

How can saving lives ever be a "distraction?" If we don't impeach Bush & Cheney for lying us into an aggressive war, another President will do it again. The only hope for the rule of law lies in following the law. The legal case for impeachment is crystal. Do we have the courage to enforce it?

Hey Vern!

"The legal choice for impeachment is crystal."

Crystal what? Crystal meth?

Cite me statutes, Constitutional provisions, court case precedent, proffer your evidence, produce your witnesses, prove your case.

But don't confuse a generalization with substantive analysis.

So many of the imp imps confuse their opinion with evidence; they feel like the President should be impeached, and their feelings are all the evidence necessary.

How very Kindergarten! But typical of self-obsessed Boomer, Gen-X, and Millenial Gen thinking: it's all about them and their feelings.

I want impeachment, and I want it now! Now, now, now, now, now!!!

Time to send the lot to their rooms with no supper!

Time to remind you...I live in the 45th District, and Eric Oemig is a disgrace to his district. Word on the street out our way is that other 45th District legislators, Democrats all, can barely disguise their contempt for the man.

The Piper

The definition of “ad hominem attack” is attacking the person instead of discussing the issue. I submit the following examples:

Kristi Brown: “Senator Oemig is a cankor sore” and a “nutso”.

Piper Scot: “Oemig is a puke” who “lied” and “connived” and who is “unethical in his legislative behavior”, and “Eric Oemig is a bag packing hey-boy of the netroots/DailyKus/MoveOn ultra-left wing of the Democratic Party” who “acts like the drunk guy at a party who wears a lampshade and tries to kiss all the girls...and who never gets invited back!”.

Hinton: “this clown is a waste of skin” and “the pimple of the buttocks of the left”.

YIKES: “You devout LEFTIST clowns are game-playing cowards .... sitting in comfort while others do your heavy lifting in the military. You make me sick.”

Kathleen: “When you vote for a dope smoking commie, you get a dope-smoking commie fruitcake. what do you expect?” and calls those supporting Oemig “fruit loops, fruitcakes, commies, marxists, lenin-lovers. seattle-tacoma never saw a commie they didn't like...:) and they all love their dope, too...”

Piper Scott again: “Eric Oemig? The Vidkun Quisling of our time, that's who he is.” And continuing on to call Oemig “a back stabber”, who is “playing ideologically driven gutter politics in Olympia.”

Andy Kern: “moonbats. Still itching for that impeachment” and “Try shelving you BDS long enough to grow up and join the rest of us adults.”

Piper Scott again: “those who come to the battle of wits unarmed” and “all you imp imps” and “the frothy-mouthed out there among you” and his apparent personal favorite “Bilious humbug!”

Wow, I bet these folks' parents are all real proud of them for their ability to discuss things like adults.

To Harry C. Ballantyne:

So what you're telling us is that you served as the stochastic engine for the most grotesque manifestation of evil that mankind has ever devised. That tells us all we need to know about your frame of reference.

To Harry C. Ballantyne:

Oh yeah, great Carter reference too. Carter is always the perfect equation for indicating how inverse the wackjob logic is. Someone needs to tell Jimmy Carter that a higher misery index ISN'T better.

Oh how I pine for the days of 10% unemployment and 14% interest rates.

It's time for you idiots to get on the team and come on in for the big win....

To Elliot:

"Wow, I bet these folks' parents are all real proud of them for their ability to discuss things like adults."

Was that a lesson on how to discuss the issues?

I noticed that you managed to sift through all of the Mr. Piper's writings and find everything but his discussion of the issues.

"Do we have the courage to enforce it?" Vernon, there is no courage required, because there is no factual basis to impeach. Really, don't you think the Democrats in Congress and the Senate would jump at the chance to impeach the prez?? Of course they would, they don't because there's nothing there.

AngryAmerican says " The Bush administration has lied to take our country to war, has lied to keep us there, has chipped away at our civil liberties, illegally spied on us, has outed a CIA agent, has corrupted the DOJ, is committing war crimes, and trying to provoke another war."

All a bunch of hooey, Bush lied is past it's prime for ranting, there was no "outing" by the Bush admin., Every time GWB makes a move the left tries to make a scandal out of it, i.e. DOJ firings, wire taps (the Dems now endorse) blah, blah, blah.

Every single one of you impeachment proponents are missing the point. When we(not me) elected Oemig we did so based on a campaign platform that mentioned nothing of impeachment procedings. One of two things happened: (1)he arrogantly abandonded his campaign platform, or, (2)he never intended to abide by it to begin with. Either way it's unethical and a great disservice to the body politic--assuming that we know what's good for us, which you would likely disagree with. So, in your opinions, foresaking his constituency is justified as long as it satisfies the greater good; the means justify the ends. This rings of the torture debate. Remind me where you stand on that. How very big it is of you to sacrifice our well-being for the common good....

Yo, David -- 500 people showed up to testify at the hearing last year. How many bills get that level of support? So your position is that we should just ignore dozens of admitted felonies by Bush and Cheney (as well as Bush ignoring 700 statutes with signing statements) because it would be inconvenient to impeach them? I suppose we should just be "good Germans" and shut the hell up.

It's amazing that the Pelosi-crats, when they were out of power during the Bush/Cheney tenure for the first six years, had the so-called BASEMENT IMPEACHMENT HEARINGS, but now that they're in power, they may as well be an adjunct of the Bush rule. The basement hearings were an act for the Pelosi-crats to draw votes from their left-wing base, whom they consistently make fools out of every two years. That's why disenchanted coffee house liberals are leaving the Democrats in droves.

www.PartyofCommons.com

I want to thank Senator Oemig for taking this entirely appropriate and necessary action. Appropriate because of the rule written by Thomas Jefferson that empowers local assemblies to initiate actions like this, especially in this case where the Federal government has failed to act. Necessary because, even with a relatively short time left in Bush's term, we can't set a precedent that the last year of the term will see no accountability.

Before this country can move forward our faith that our elected officials adhere to the rule of law and support and defend the constitution needs to be restored. NO President Democrat or Republican should be above the law and the cases are well documented that this administration is ignoring the intent if not the letter of the law. Our system of checks and balances demands that impeachment take place for any high crimes or misdemeanors.

Senator Oemig is a courageous patriot. I support him and every person who joins him in We The People's quest to have the U.S. President and V.President obey and uphold the U.S. Constitution and American law.

V.P Cheney and crew have lied to us over and over. They have disregarded the Constitution and American (and International) law.

If we do not put our foot down, then they set precedent for all future administrations, a precedent that subverts our country and everything the American constitution represents.

Senator Oemig is a great senator. He is listening to the people, and he is abiding by his oath to uphold the Constitution.

getaclue -

You need to "get a clue", no high crimes or misdemeanors have taken place, it doesn't matter how many times you say it, it isn't true, so get a clue.

The impeachment of George W. Bush is not simply about unseating a sitting President. It is about defending the Constitution. The fact that President Bush only has a short time left in office is not a legitimate excuse to avoid this confrentation. If the Presesident has violated the Constitution time after time as many people have suggested, an impeachment trial would be the appropriate place to determine the facts. Those pushing for impeachment are concerned with Constitutional protections which have been ignored by the Bush administration. To give the president a pass on his alleged law breaking would give future Presidents the same opportunity. This should not be a partician issue. A future president from either party could use President Bush's unlawful behavior as precident and that is a step toward dictatorship where the leader of the government is above the law.

Bothsides -

I think you need to "get a clue" as well. You state clearly that "no high crimes or misdemeanors have taken place, it doesn't matter how many times you say it, it isn't true, so get a clue."

You say this with such certainty but you don't answer anyone's question. You ought to run for office. Maybe you could be Romney's running mate and lie to the people of Michigan that he's going to save their jobs.

The term "high crimes and misdemeanors" is in the Constitution, long before any laws were put on the books. It's up to the people of this country to determine what high crimes exactly are (unless you have a specific list) and urge their elected representatives to start impeachment hearings immediately.

If you want to be more than a discredited bully on this board, answer some questions people have.

Kristi Brown -

So you're saying Eric stay home in his own little district and pretend he's making progress on the Viaduct or Highway 520.

Well, if we didn't have a President and Vice President who fraudulently tricked this country and this Congress into the Iraq war, we wouldn't be spending $15 billion per month and we could easily afford these roads projects.

You see, Kristi, everything is connected. And money that is spent on the military-industrial complex ($600+ billion per year) is money not available to roads.

I love the phrase "moonbats" -- such a neat way to insult without (a) triggering profanity filters or (b) actually saying anything of substance.

Whether you like it or not, impeachment is not a partisan issue. "High crimes and misdemeanors" is indeed a technical term with a precise meaning -- and violating the oath of office (to support the Constitution, remember?), lying under office, and starting a war under false pretenses ALL can be construed to be impeachable offenses.

The worst crime would be NOT impeaching. But sadly, I'm pretty sure that's what will happen.

Okay, I'm a conservative independent who USED to call himself a republican. I'm not a Bush fan. I'm also not a radical Seattle liberal who thinks he's dumb as paint while simultaneously giving him credit for masterminding 9/11 himself... but I have been generally disappointed at many levels. I would support impeachment if it were called for; the only thing I think congress could impeach for is incompetence, but that would be shaky. Let's be clear about this, there is no criminal or abuse of power case to be made right now. That's just reality. You lefties may hate the President, and that's your prerogative. There's a big difference, however, between being impeachable and being distasteful to the Seattle leftward establishment. If Oemig were any kind of capable politician, he would see this. He would also recognize he's embarrassing himself as a state legislator delving into an area clearly over his head.

Shall we impeach Gregoire for gifting public funds to non-citizens?

Everyone take a deep breath. I'm happy to host this debate, but not if it turns into nothing more than name-calling.

I can't respond to everything, but Chris, I think you're mistaken about 500 people showing up for the hearing last year. Not even close. I was there and we had another reporter in the overflow room. I covered this issue more than any other reporter last year, and I must say I covered it with very few complaints. It's just wrong to suggest a year later that somehow my reporting was flawed.

How about a post on Ron Sims and the Maple Valley rip-off then David? It has all the elements of a scandal, back room deals, Electeds getting big contributions,no-bid favors to lobbyists and Developers. Why no follow-up on the January 2nd front page story? It simply doesn't look balanced.

Not only was impeachment not the focal point of Oemig's campaign, it wasn't even a footnote.

Impeachment is not what's at issues here. What's at issue here is the deceipt perpetrated by Oemig on the people of the 45th district. Will someone please justify this?

Impeachment is not just a distraction. It's required by the constitution for certain offenses.

If you want to argue that leading a nation to war -- a war that has already cost more American lives than Sept. 11th -- under false pretenses is not a "high crime or misdemeanor;" in other words, an impeachable offense, then I'm just speechless. I'm not sure what Bush would have to do in order to be impeached if a war based on a lie is permissible -- murder babies and puppies in the Oval Office?

Impeachment is not a verdict; it is a trial. And far from being a distraction, if the crimes are impeachable and there's a real debate over their validity, it is required by law -- by the oath of office to the Constitution -- that legislators pursue it.

Postman...

Those who scream that your reporting is flawed because you truthfully mentioned how little support Oemig has among other Democrats similarly regard the fact of absolute absence of evidence in support of their insistence upon impeachment as "flawed."

The impeachment effort is a partisan move by extremists on the left, the ultimate revenge for the 2000 election. It's grounded in opinion and interpretation, not truth or fact. And it has no support beyond the some 16% of the Democratic Party that identifies itself as "very liberal" (The number comes from CNN's Bill Schneider after the January 3rd Iowa Caucuses).

That Eric Oemig is wasting the legislature's time and resources when other, more pressing matters demand immediate attention is cynical beyond belief.

Typical of the hyperbole and exaggeration is the 500 in attendance figure that was just seriously debunked. Throughout this thread are similar mistakes or intentional mistatements of fact. The imp imps believe what they want to believe and refuse to let data, the law, or political reality dissuade them.

King Canute told the tide to stand still, but that didn't make it so.

I've said this already, but it bears repeating: in the 45th District, Eric Oemig has alienated himself from his colleagues with stunts like this. Had an e-mail from a fellow 45'er (like a 49'er only political and minus 4) who attended a Town Hall meeting where it was apparent that at least one of Oemig's State House colleagues could hardly stand being in the room with him.

Quickly looking over the various imp imps' offerings, they share characteristics:

(1) Conclusion oriented without evidence. "Bush lied." Oh? Where? What did he say? How do you know he lied? Were others who shared his belief liars too?"

(2) Bush violates the Constitution. Again...How? Says who? What court has held the President has engaged in egregious intentional violations of the Constitution?

(3) Congress is a bunch of wimps. Oh good! First you demand Congress act, then you call it names. Been around politics long? Certainly that's not the way to get anyone to see it your way.

(4) If someone isn't in agreement, then that person is complicit in whatever "high crimes and misdemeanors" have taken place. I can see the gulags now.

(5) So many of the postings have the same or similar messages that one has to wonder if but what they weren't generated off of a "suggested blog message to post at David Postman's Seattle Times political blog." Won't be the first sock puppet time, and it won't be the last.

The issues raised were settled by the election of 2004 where a lot of this stuff was on the table. The American people decided that they wanted George W. Bush as their President, and that they wanted him to do exactly what the imp imps complain of.

The President's first and primary duty is the protection of the American people. Were he to not do the things complained of by the imp imps, then he would be the subject of an impeachment effort for failing in his duty.

While moral equivalency arguments aren't proof of or justification for anything, it's still instructive to remember that every wartime President in the history of the Republic has dinked with the Constitution in means and manner infinitely and eternally far, far worse than anything George W. Bush has done.

What Oemig is doing insults my sons who serve in uniform. What they have to say about him and his efforts can't be printed in a family newspaper.

Mainstream and conservative Americans see the impeachment effort for what it is: posturing, pompous partisan politics. And harmful to progress on the real issues facing the nation. In Washington State, even Democrats find it offensive since it embarrasses them and distracts from paying attention to legitimate state business.

It's obvious that Eric Oemig could care less about anything other than being the Hey-Boy for the extreme left thinking it will stand him in good stead with wealthy lefties come 2010. Trouble is, it will also motivate people in the 45th District to turn it and restore sanity to our legislative delegation.

The Piper

Gosh Piper, don't blow a heart valve. Your darling of incompetence and flawed conservative values is not going to be impeached. The Dems have actually done a pretty good job keeping it off the table, as the Speaker said she would.

Now look.
1. There certainly ARE several good constitutional cases for impeachment, whether or not you understand them or happen to agree.
2. These constitutional validity of these charges cannot be measured by how many are determined to conduct an impeachment, since there are other considerations - like running the country another year before he's gone anyway - that are influencing the debate.
3. There are many constitutional and legal scholars with no partisan dog in this fight, who make an excellent case for impeachment. Those of lesser qualification or questionable motive, do not make it any less so.

Doing the right thing for the wrong reason, still gets the right thing done.

I strongly support the immediate impeachment of Dick Cheney and George W. Bush. How can we have allowed these criminals to continue occupying the White House? We have many challenging issues facing us, but to me the main one is the toxic corporate takeover of our government. Impeach now! It's not a moment too soon. I applaud State Senator Oemig for introducing SJM 8016. I also applaud Congressman Dennis Kucinich for introducing impeachment legislation in the U.S. House of Representatives. These are courageous and true patriotic Americans!

Well, the White House provided another possible article today in announcing that ALL the e-mail back-up tapes through 2003 were "recycled", which effectively destroyed the last known copy of presidential documents (papers) - millions of them, paid for by and produced in the service to the citizenry - which the administrative branch is required by law to preserve.

JimD...

I know he's not going to be impeached. I just like to play with my food before eating it ;~}

But George W. Bush is right to be in Iraq and Afghanistan, and I support those efforts. Additionally, I've seen and heard all the pro-impeachment arguments, and they don't hold water, but they are politically motivated.

That so-called "experts" who contend impeachment is warranted can be rebutted by as many if not more who will say the opposite. Any trial lawyer will tell you that you can buy an opinion to support anything under the sun, including the existence of little green men. Law professors are as much for hire as analytic chemists or forensic accountants.

Some Bush policies are controversial and some go to the edge, but after 9/11 all bets were off. If his Iraq statements and understandings are grounds for impeachment, better go after former President Clinton, PM Tony Blair, the Russians, the French and the rest of the world because the shared them, which was exactly Saddam Hussein's intent.

Issues relative to the NSA, surveillance, monitoring of financial transactions are all legal gray areas. Ditto Gitmo and extra-territorial CIA activity. Further, Congress has acted to endorse or modify to resolve issues a lot of these policies and activities. The lawful Patriot Act and the Military Commission Act have Democratic support, and impeachment undergirded with this stuff would necessarily suck in the Democratic Party.

There is no impeachment case.

The Piper

Piper -

You said:
"Issues relative to the NSA, surveillance, monitoring of financial transactions are all legal gray areas. Ditto Gitmo and extra-territorial CIA activities."

You may be happy to live in a country without a Constitution and you may put complete and total faith in government employees with no accountability at all, but I do not.

Maybe you should move to China where you can be sure you have alot fewer rights and the government will be your Big Brother and tell you exactly what to do. And they'll be happy to shoot you if you don't comply.

Borkowski...

Then show me all the court holdings supporting your POV. Show me the Congressional and other legislative support for your POV.

That we have terrorists locked up at Gitmo doesn't threaten me, it makes me - you, too - safer.

That aggressive efforts are under way to detect terrorist activities means that our rights to live as we please are being protected.

If you don't want the NSA to monitor a communication of yours, then make sure you don't communicate with a suspected terrorist in a foreign country.

If you don't want to be sent to Gitmo, then don't take up arms against the United States or support those who do.

Whatever you do, don't trot out those cliched "Constitution" arguments because they're hollow, politically motivated, lacking credibility, and bordering on boy-who-cried-wolf laughability.

Your "move to China" slap falls into that latter category.

The Piper

Piper -

It's truly unclear how much of a threat terrorists are because the Pentagon is clearly engaged in fraud to try to start a war with Iran, just like they did with Iraq. The incident this week with an audio released by the Pentagon was a complete fake. And a really amateur job at that. Apparently, the Pentagon propaganda department spliced a voice over the top of some of the regular chatter between the Navy ship and some small Iranian boats. But they got called on it as being fake and now they're lying about that too. But it's clearly fake. I'm sure you believe the whole incident was real and we should have nuked Iran but the fact remains, the audio was fake. It was a fabrication by top Pentagon warmakers to try to instigate a war with Iran.

That's why impeachment hearings right now are so important. The people in office aren't public servants. They're oil executives and they are only interested in starting more wars so they can control more oil. Their actions are making that very clear.

This Administration will continue to create more fake incidents like this in an attempt to engage and attack Iran. If they succeed, we'll quickly see what $200/barrel oil looks like. And this could all happen by July.

Polling on Impeachment

A total of 70% of American voters say that Vice President Dick Cheney has abused his powers as vice president.

Of the 70%, 61% (43% of all voters) say the abuses rise to the level of impeachable offenses and Mr. Cheney should be impeached and removed from office.

Source: American Research Group
http://americanresearchgroup.com/impeach/

Impeachable Offense 1
The President and Vice President knowingly used fraudulent Information to persuade Congress and the American public to support the Iraq War

Supporting evidence (pre-hearing)
- There is ample evidence from former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neil that Bush was already planning to invade Iraq long before 9/11.

- The leaked Downing Street memo stated that the intelligence and facts were "being fixed" to support military action.

- The President and Vice President went around the country saying there was a connection between Al Qaeda and Iraq. This was false and Richard Clarke, as well as the CIA before the State of the Union speech in 2003, had told them that on numerous occasions.

- The President and Vice President argued that the war was necessary because Saddam was perilously close to making nuclear weapons. This was false and the UN, the State Department and the CIA told the President it was false. The President even ignored the request by CIA director to delete this claim from the 2003 State of the Union Address.

Violations:
- Committing a Fraud against the United States
- Fraud and false statements to Congress
- Violation of War Powers Resolution

I'll bet Borkowski also believes it was a missle that really hit the Pentagon, right Borkowski?
And the same with the Twin Towers. Right??
Borkowski has glued together certain documents after the fact like Frankenstein to attempt to rationalize impeachment. If his mass conspiracy is true, Democrats who had access to info should be impeached as well.
Oernig is the fault of apathetic voters in the 45th who failed to do their homework. I doubt they will make the same mistake again.
Oernig should be focusing on the $6 Billion underfunded State Pension Fund and the shell-game accounting that created this phantom Budget Surplus/Rainy-Day Fund by not funding the State Pension Fund adequately. Duh.
It's called "triangulation" folks.
Get constituents to focus on some national/global issue so they won't question his failures in things directly under his control like the Pension Fund deficit.

Borkowski...

So...all your offer of proof is:

- Contingency planning. Given that Saddam Hussein was perceived as a legitmate and pretty nasty threat by the entire world, you should be relieved that the Bush administration had the foresight to plan.

- Assertions of disgruntled former Bush Administration employees. Paul O'Neill, not the most credible of witnesses, would be shredded on cross-examination by a first-year law student.

- Leaked British memos. Ooooohhh!!! How self-serving is that???

- The testimony of one Richard Clarke, another disgruntled former employee, a partisan hack, an individual now regarded as one of the bigger liars ever produced by Washington, and an individual whose major bone to pick was that his was an opinion un-listened to.

- The mistaken belief that Saddam Hussein was going nuclear when that was in fact the exact impression Saddam Hussein sought to create. Even his own generals thought he had WMDs, among them an approaching nuclear capability. If this is an impeachable offense, best make the indictment list a couple miles long because every other intelligence agency in the Westen World was similarly confinced.

- That George Bush didn't do the bidding of the people who worked for him in any number of different Executive Branch agencies. Welcome to day in, day out, political life since the days of, oh George Washington.

- Dubious polling data. Tell it to voters in the NH Demo Prexy primary. Additionally, relying on push-polling questions in support of anything is a sign of utter desparation.

Your "evidence" and $5 will get you a cup of coffee. It's 95-lbs-weakling puny, Dennis-Kucinich-UFO-sighting credible, and Bertha-Mason-Rochester (Obtuse literary reference that suggests you need something better to do with your life like read a book) nuts.

Oh, and its Eric-Oemig-like shrill, partisan, and cynical.

If "comitting a fraud against the United States" is an impeachable offense, go after the entire Congress of the United States since they wrote the book on the subject.

Yours is the extreme minority viewpoint. Yours is the hper-partisan viewpoint. Yours is the viewpoint inimical to the interests of the United States. Yours is the viewpoint that's the latest festering manifestation of long held political grievances against George W. Buxh.

Yours is the viewpoint that's dangerous to my sons since it encourages our enemies.

I'll stay bulldog-tough and persistent on this issue in their honor; it's my way of supporting them and their comrades-in-arms.

Last but certainly not least, again Eric Oemic is a worse-than-typical cynical and conniving politician. Politicians pander, it's what they do, and Oemig is pandering to you. In the American political tradition of demagogues, his shrill bloody-shirt-waving rhetoric has its roots in the worst excesses of people like Huey P. Long and George Wallace.

As my oldest son the staff sergeant would say, "Oemig, sucks to be you."

The Piper

Congratulations to Senator Oemig for his courage. He is obviously more concerned about the rule of law, and upholding the Constitution than any political career he might have in his future. Maybe we should continue to elect him to public office for his refresing stands against politicians who no longer represent the people.

I've living in thge 45th for 27 years.
We are like the frogs in the pot of water that is oh so slowly being brought to a boil...

I, too, initially thought that perhaps this was a "distraction" but was quickly disabused of that idea by becoming fully educated:
Impeachment, the Cure for the Royals- a book by John Nichols, I believe. (He was also interviewed on the Bill Moyers program).

I, too, want my constitutional rights back, NOW.

This is no distraction. This is the very foundation on which the entire process stands. Go Eric!

Piper,
You don't get it. The constitution does not define the specifics that warrant impeachment. The broad "high crimes and misdemeanors" is dependent on the laws in place at the time, which in turn are subject to constitutional interpretation... Our founders wisely left the door wide open for virtually any impeachment case we want, so long as it was based on SOME breach of law.
You may not agree with those gung-ho to impeach, but "no case" is an opinion, not a fact.. Are you being disingenuous, or do you truly not understand this relatively simple constitutional component?

With only about one-quarter of the country happy with his performance, and about half the country despising the guy to no end, he's getting off easy, for the wrong reasons of course - political expedience and clock running down on his rampage through the admin branch. But I dare say - earlier generations, presumably of higher constitutional fiber than the wishy-washy politicians we have now, would not only have impeached him but probably tried him for treason and shot him. There's PLENTY of illegal behavior that could be applied, although a simple speeding ticket (a misdemeanor) is all the constitution requires.

I'll say this one more time because some (*cough* Piper *cough*) seem to have overlooked it: impeachment is a trial, not a verdict.

If you TRULY believe that the POTUS/VPOTUS are innocent, you should WELCOME the opportunity to prove that through impeachment proceedings.

Bill Clinton was impeached -- and acquitted. Don't discount the possibility that that might happen to Cheney/Bush (I don't believe it, but in the rule of law it's always a possibility).

The only suspicious behavior is to try to keep impeachment from happening. By doing that, you say "I don't care what the alleged offenses are. I don't care what evidence does, or does not exist. All I care about is making sure that 'my team' never has to undergo a legal proceeding that might, just might, find them guilty."

In other words, by denying impeachment, you look like you're afraid of the possible outcome.

If you're not afraid he'll be convicted, why fight the impeachment proceedings so hard?

As to Democrats who believe that Bush lied but that impeachment is, rather than a requirement by the Constitution, a "distraction" -- I have nothing but contempt for you. You don't deserve America.

Oh Tom - your force me into an implied allegiance with Piper (ugh!) to properly challenge your closing statement.
Impeachment of Bush would be the next "trial of the century" - not just a distraction, but a total obsession with what only amounts to a vindication for those who (properly, in my view) believe Bush has administered one illegality after another.
There will be plenty of post-administration evidence and dirt uncovered, and time to process it, to validate the illegal nature of Bush's presidency in the years to come.
The constitutional provisions for impeachment allows this subjective discretion in deciding whether to conduct an impeachment trial, as the decision to conduct a trial must be weighed against other considerations. In this case, it's getting through this election, starting to repair the damage this administration has wrought, and focusing on the future.
Are those goals not better served by not expending our limited resources of energy and time on impeachment at this late stage in Bush's rule?

JimD,

if we don't impeach then w still gets to pardon, veto, spend, direct, and execute our federal government however he likes for another year. as his administration shows no regard for congressional or judicial oversight i believe that pursuing impeachment is the ONLY way to work towards repairing the damage, reversing his illegal actions, and healing the country. this wait a year business is simply a dead political gesture to those who are not yet ready to accept it's necessity. we accomplish nothing without impeachment.

upchuck,
If the votes were there to actually do that, I'd agree. But they are not, and getting them would paralyze what little functionality there is and produce more political net damage than good, even accounting for another year of illegalities from the Bush admin.
The principle is noble and just, but is the battle worth the casualties if we cannot calculate a win? And is that not a bit analogous to the real war, which was similarly mis-calculated?

JimD- The votes come *after* the impeachment hearings. Same with Nixon, and with Clinton. Nobody can predict what will come out if we finally get an investigation. And impeachment is the only way to get an investigation.

Don't you want to know about the 20 million missing mails? The video tape of torure? Don't you worry about the spying and lying and general abuses of power of the executive branch? I don't want Hillary or anyone else having that power!

As for your war analogy of 'principle vs. strategy': it is not a good analogy- this war was most definitely *not* started on principle. This one has been in the works for a while, and only 9/11 allowed them to pull it off.

The analogy here is like if a judge decided not to put a murderer on trial, because "it'll probably just upset the victim's family" and "he'll probably just go free anyway". That's not how we preserve the constitution and democracy. WE NEED IMPEACHMENT FOR THE HEARINGS, REGARDLESS OF THE OUTCOME. Besides, impeachment helps the impeaching party in the election that follows - so the stragety part is good too :)

Peter,
The purpose of impeachment is to remove a president from office. The trial's hearings and investigation are a constitutional provision given us to reach THAT end.
Just *using* the trial to investigate the many wrong doings of this administration not only tweaks the constitutional intent of impeachment (in spirit at least) but has a built-in incentive to continue the trial beyond the point where evidence to-date could justify his earliest removal. Doesn't your justification for pursuing impeachment create the need to extend the process way beyond the point at which the trial could otherwise produce a verdict?
Although I'd like nothing more than to spend the next year documenting for history this administration's illegal behavior in the formal setting of congressional testimony under the solemn proceedings of an impeachment trial, it would constitute the right thing (discovery) for the wrong reason (also discovery) and would not result in an earlier removal from office than his term already dictates - unless you believe all these revelations could be pried from resistant witnesses in less than a year.
And history WILL reveal the truth - both in hard documentation and retrospective reflection - that Bush was the most corrupt and incompetent chief executive we've ever had.
We've got a rough future ahead of us - FUTURE being the key word. We cannot afford to spend the next year proving "we were right all along", when the political opposition is becoming fully aware of this administration's folly anyway.
I also don't think we serve future administrations by setting a precedent of using impeachment for any purpose other than to remove a president from office.

USELESS