E.L.F. Members are Terrorists

"Earth Liberation Front members are no better than Al Qaida terrorists." Um, ELF people don't kill anybody. Surely that's a cognizable difference, right? I understand that you think that maybe, despite the fact that no ELF member has declared this, ELF members might start hurting people.

I'll agree that"[t]hey have and [sic] established pattern of using destruction and fear to bring about a change in behavior," but that hardly means that your conclusion that "they certainly don't care about the lives of firefighters" is any less hysterical (or more sensical), nor does it justify your the sort of lazy moral equivalence line of thought you're engaging in here.

Look, there are plenty of people out there that wreck property for no good reason; let's not elevate this particular subset of criminals to demonic status just because they have some purpose in mind.

Are you telling me that a group that uses explosives to commit arson cares what happens to the firefighters? What about any other person that might have come along?

When you stop your ridiculous rationalization of what these nut jobs are doing, I might ease up on the "lazy moral equivalence."

Besides, I'm much more comfortable demonizing terrorists than making excuses for them.

Devericks, I don't believe I once made an excuse or rationalization for anybody from ELF (in fact, I called them "criminals")--I just pointed out that they have not killed or injured anybody, and that your equation of ELF with al Qaeda doesn't take this into account.

Let me elaborate: if you consider ELF to be the same as al Qaeda, you are either understating the danger of al Qaeda, or overstating the danger of ELF. That's lazy, and something that a more nuanced cartoonist would avoid doing.

But hey, I respect your quest to demonize terrorists. It's a thought-provoking, risky position for you to take, but that's why you are rewarded with a forum in the Seattle Times, right? Anyway, just to show that we're all friends, I'll make a recommendation for a Devericks-style cartoon illustrating this very theme. Draw a fierce looking guy with bat wings and horns on his head (maybe he's holding a pitchfork). Give him a large lapel button that says "Demon" and then write the word "Terrorist" across his belly. Add some flies and stuff around his head, and then you are done my friend!

In ideology ELF is no better that Al Qaada. When I was in Iraq, Hezbollah and "Al Qaida in Mesopotamia" did not kill everyone with opposing views, in fact most of the time it they did exactly what this group did -- burn their homes.

What ELF hopes to accomplish by doing this is change people's views to accompany their own. The exact same as Al Qaida. This is the pure definition of terrorism. To assume it is better because they are domestic or perhaps even on par with your own is no better than the what the Taliban was. Although the Taliban did not participate in the majority of injustices, they did facilitate Al Qaida in performing them.

What really concerns me is how many in the Seattle Metro area wish try and justify or lighten this terrible act of terrorism.

Zack, I'm annoying people like you and any cartoonist (even "a more nuanced"one) would consider that a job well done.

Devericks,

If your goal is to "annoy people like" me, fantastic. However, I'm not annoyed, just saddened that the Seattle Times editorial page continually publishes such low-quality cartoons. That's all. But hey, if that's your goal, then by all means, pat yourself on the back.

pat pat

Can someone explain to me how a 4200-4700 sq ft house can be environmentally friendly? Compared to what, a million sq ft house. Let's start thinking green before it's all gone.

My guess is that it wasn't ELF at all. With the mortgage situation, no contracts on the houses torched and the economy slipping, I'd say we need to look at the builders as being the culprits.

I'm not agreeing with either viewpoint, but I do want to make sure there is no misconception of how terrorism is defined.

The definition is: "the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion"

Terror is defined as (#4 possibly being the most appropriate): "1: a state of intense fear
2 a: one that inspires fear : scourge b: a frightening aspect c: a cause of anxiety : worry d: an appalling person or thing; especially : brat
3: reign of terror
4: violent or destructive acts (as bombing) committed by groups in order to intimidate a population or government into granting their demands

Mookie has a point. All too often we allow the media to encourage an obvious conclusion and then we run with it. Maybe those homes were torched for another reason. Follow the money.

That said, I'm no fan of ELF or ALF or any of those other shady groups. Violence isn't the answer.

I'm on Eric's side. Certainly ELF hasn't YET stooped to the murderous level that Al Qaida has, but defining ELF as terrorists is an astute description of what it is they do. They've already been labeled in the media as "Ecoterrorists", and I think that Eric is just contemplating as to what their next crazy step MIGHT be. Who can say what will make them snap? Who is to say that they won't start targeting SUV's and other environmentally hazardous luxuries of private citizens? I'm putting an addition on my house, what if they target me and the grass I dug up?

Whenever there is a fire, it puts firefighters at risk. Period. Anyone who deliberately sets a fire puts firefighters at risk. Anyone who sets that deliberate fire with explosive devices puts firefighters at risk. I'd have to agree that ELF has little regard for the lives of these brave firefighters. They could have just as easily vandalized the homes without putting anyone at risk except a cleanup crew. I refuse to believe that it "slipped their minds" that setting fire to these huge structures would be dangerous to anyone.

Oh, and now let me switch my soapbox to this whole environmental thing. I'm the first person to bring back my recycling from a vacation home that doesn't provide it, so hear me clearly ELF. I've worked for a builder for over 10 years, and while building houses generally isn't environmentally friendly,there are steps that builders take when they certify their homes as "Built Green". Unfortunately, it's much more expensive, so it's not a common practice but in a home that will sell for over $1 million, it's easy to include more environmentally friendly aspects like recycled materials and higher efficiency standards. Visit the Built Green website to learn what tactics they are using. SETTING FIRE TO 4-4000+ SQ. FT. HOMES IS SIMPLY CAUSING MORE ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE. Sort of puts a damper on your parade huh? Did you think of the toxins that are released when a house burns? Did you think of the amount of water that had to be used to put the fires out? Did you think about the damaging runoff because of that water and fire retardant? Did you think about the extra waste you caused during the cleanup of these sites? What about the big gaping holes in the landscape now that those houses are gone? Do you honestly think that the builders are just going to plant trees there, release bunnies and go away because you scared them into it? I seriously wish extremist groups like you would take all that energy and all that time and all that passion and find another way of spreading your message.

And it's absolutely ridiculous to suggest that reputable builders would burn down their own homes. For homes as large and expensive as these and considering the current market, they certainly haven't gone "stale" quite yet. In fact one of the homes had just had an offer accepted by the builder and another offer was in the works.

The members of ELF are so incredibly arrogant and stupid.

I love how utterly useless ELF's acts of destruction are. Every time they have burned something down, it gets rebuilt. So, when they destroy something, not only do they fail in changing anyone's habits, they double the natural resources and energy used to build something.
Burn a SUV? Fine, the dealership gets the insurance payment and orders another. These houses they destroyed will be rebuilt, and now they will end up using twice the the materials. Haah! Dumb*%#es!

If not terrorists then what? They blew up my professors lab in the fire they started half a decade ago, claiming that he was genetically engineering trees. The ELF is so stupid, his research had nothing to do with genetic engineering. They blew up several million dollars worth of equipment on a whim, having complete ignorance and complete stupidity of what they were doing. It's sickening how low these guys stoop all in the interest of doing what they think is "green."

Who has proven this is the work of ELF?
Seems to me could as easily be the builder collecting the insurance money. These buildings have sat unsold for well over a year. That says they will not sell at the asking price and in this market would probably sit for another year, unsold. Meanwhile the builder is loosing his shirt.
So, how convenient to have a trial of an ELFer going on and another just brought in from Canada to stand trial in Colorado. Hang a spray painted sheet with "ELF" on it, burn the buildings down, collect the insurance.
Too easy to hang this on ELF.

Maybe, maybe, maybe next time a great god will come from the sky and dance all over the earth while juggling!

Since insurance policies typically do not cover acts of terrorism, the developers of this burned real estate probably want this case to be classified as the far less glamorous "arson".

"The Earth Liberation Front (ELF), also known as "Elves" or "The Elves", is the collective name for anonymous and autonomous individuals or groups that use "economic sabotage and guerrilla warfare to stop the exploitation and destruction of the natural environment", commonly known as ecotage or monkeywrenching."

The ends do not justify the means. Great Political Cartoon ... as usual.

ELF are just another brand of liberal terorrists.

Since I do so love stiring the pot I will agree that E.L.F. is a terrorist organization by the definition given here: a group with "and established pattern of using destruction and fear to bring about a change in behavior". However this definition fits the description of our President's "Shock and Awe" pre-emptive attacks on Iraq and, for that matter, the entire "war on terror". Does it not? Maybe we should think a little bit about this broad stroke? Go ahead flame me...I just want to provoke a little spark of debate from a different angle.

They may both be terrorist organizations, but their targets (so far) have been different.

Islamists often directly target human life, with no moral qualms about erasing the long-accepted division between enemy combatant and civilian. ELF so far targets buildings - almost always avoiding loss of human life, even if inadvertently. This is an important distinction that I think is missed in this cartoon.

As Israel commonly says, "There is no moral equivalence."

Heretics, witches, communists, terrorists, ELFs.
Humans enjoy exaggerating a foe in order to distract from their own failures.

"Humans enjoy exaggerating a foe in order to distract from their own failures."

Maybe, but it's the weakest and most cowardly that terrorize others because they are not getting their way.

Equating a group that has never actually harmed a single human being with the terrorist group that successfully destroyed the World Trade Center, took over Afghanistan in the 1990's, and brought the United States to a halt in fear in 2001 is simply preposterous.

You seem to think that you have stumbled onto an incredibly profound realization, but in fact this is a very childish cartoon with no depth or nuance that simply shows you lack the ability to distinguish two very different groups from one another. ELF is not al-Qaeda. You know what would have been a more interesting cartoon? Replace Osama bin Laden with George W. Bush standing amidst the rubble of Baghdad. Then again, that is a connection you would undoubtedly not have been intelligent enough to make.

Well, since you're seriously stretching analogies here and just making stuff up, I'll just go ahead and say Eric Devericks' cartoon is no better than Nazi propaganda. Maybe I'll even write an op/ed piece about it.

First, you can't even spell Al Queda. How much could you possibly know abou them?

Second, ALF/ELF have a tenet that NO ONE shall be harmed, human or non-human. Notice these are EMPTY houses.

When polite letters and protests, in other words legal dissent don't work, more action is sometimes necessary, and some people get tired of watching us spin our wheels. They risk their freedom and lives to further a cause, and that is NOT cowardly. Have you ever done that?

Every movement has people who committ civil disobedience. The likes of Martin Luther King would be considered a "terrorist" today under the current pathetic administration, exploiting that word to the point it means nothing.

Arson, sabatoge, yes. But terrorism, no. Al Queda takes lives, and starts a war. I don't believe that is happening with these brave souls.

You realize this cartoon would be just as accurate if you drew a rich destructive "developer" in place of ELF, and Bush and all the rest of the capitalists in place of Al.

Maybe, maybe, maybe. How about commenting about what has already happened? Al-Qaida has killed at least 3,000 Americans. ELF has killed zero.

To compare over zealous individuals destroying valuable property to people flying planes into buildings killing THOUSANDS, you show not only a lack of knowledge on the world of terror, but complete disrespect to those who died on 9/11.

You should be ashamed.